+1 how much does that package cost $500 plus for what a 1mph gain? That is a freaking joke most guys can do the ziptie mod and gain more mph then that and the cost is free. Those who say those are pretty good numbers need a reality check.
I guess I need a reality check then because those aren't bad numbers for a heavy ass car that is stock other than a cold air and tune.
I have been watching this for a few days now and some of the 4th Gen owners have got to take a pill.....gheesh
We have maybe 10 runs on the Camaro on a real drag strip and the condition on only one track is kind of a known and that was a low 13 run. The computer has not really had time to adjust yet let alone engine break in has NOT happen in 100 miles. Not every person judges a vehicle on its 1/4 mile abilities only, at least I am smart enough not to, this car is so far out in front of the last Camaro in quality and handling. This car has to appeal to a MASS market not just the .0000001% of the drag racers on here, I seem to remember back when the 4th gens hit the streets alot of people called them over weight and under powered (and they were WRONG). Give this Camaro it dues and the time to prove itself BEFORE passing a condeming judgement (a closed mind is an ignorant mind). For those here who seem to think that ever passing generation of Camaro should automaticaly be quicker than the last, so in your thinking 2 or 3 generations from now will be running with TOP FUEL DRAGSTERS???
Can't wait to see some street race videos. Wonder how a basic bolt on LS1 vs 2010 SS will fare on the streets..... Gonna be funny when old dudes who spend almost 40K get spanked by old ass 4th gens.
What's worse; wait till they get their ass spanked by a mustang or, God forbid, a Challenger, Charger, G8 or a GTO. But hey, according to the poster above you 99.99% don't care.
We have maybe 10 runs on the Camaro on a real drag strip and the condition on only one track is kind of a known and that was a low 13 run. The computer has not really had time to adjust yet let alone engine break in has NOT happen in 100 miles.
Agreed.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 406 Q-ship
Not every person judges a vehicle on its 1/4 mile abilities only, at least I am smart enough not to, this car is so far out in front of the last Camaro in quality and handling. This car has to appeal to a MASS market not just the .0000001% of the drag racers on here
I think you greatly underestimate how many drag racers are on ls1tech. Just look at all the sigs and see how many have a 1/4 mile or 1/8 mile time in them. Then factor in the ones who have a timeslip but don't advertise because they want to keep thier potential a secret. I bet the percentage of drag racers is closer to 40%. BUT that's here at ls1tech where the name of the game is modding and testing those mods. Not everyone who owns a LS1 is a member and or mods his/her car.
Of all the people who own an LS1 fbody I bet the number is closer to 5%. But .0000001% is IMO way too low.
Overall I'm impressed with everything except the weight and cost. Too heavy and too expensive. Again that's just my opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 406 Q-ship
I seem to remember back when the 4th gens hit the streets alot of people called them over weight and under powered (and they were WRONG). Give this Camaro it dues and the time to prove itself BEFORE passing a condeming judgement
Underpowered talks were partially due to GM greatly under rating the LS1 fbody. Once people started to see these cars dyno what GM said they made at the motor is when they changed thier tune. Being a solid half second quicker then the LT1 in the quarter mile didn't hurt either.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 406 Q-ship
(a closed mind is an ignorant mind).
We can debate numbers and discuss opinions but lets not quote bumper stickers
Quote:
Originally Posted by 406 Q-ship
For those here who seem to think that ever passing generation of Camaro should automaticaly be quicker than the last, so in your thinking 2 or 3 generations from now will be running with TOP FUEL DRAGSTERS???
I think that this new camaro might be a tad quicker. We havn't seen the best pass yet. Once the motors break then I'm sure someone like evan smith will get a 12.7 out of one on a nice cool east coast evening. And the trap speeds have shown them to be the "faster" car even if they havn't been proven quicker yet.
Personally, I think we are going to be headed backwards soon. Obama is all ready trying to pass a minimum emmission and MPG law. I think it's a matter of time before a new generation is considerably slower because of new federal guidelines. But that's when you buy the car and do a motor swap
__________________ 1999 Pontiac Firebird Formula ("The Chicken Hawk")
Streetsweeper cam (236/240 112 lsa), Fast 90 intake, NW TB, Lucas 42# injectors, Powerbond underdrive pulley, TSP lid, FRA, Dynomouth exhaust, Pacesetter LT headers, ORY, Circle-D 5C 4400 stall, Performabuilt level 3 4L60E, B&M 24K transmission cooler, Motive 4.10 gears & Dyno Tuned by Mike @ New Era Performance
Current best = 11.53 @ 116.77 on a 1.55 60'
Last edited by darrensls1; 05-27-2009 at 08:51 AM..
I think you greatly underestimate how many drag racers are on ls1tech. Just look at all the sigs and see how many have a 1/4 mile or 1/8 mile time in them. Then factor in the ones who have a timeslip but don't advertise because they want to keep thier potential a secret. I bet the percentage of drag racers is closer to 40%. BUT that's here at ls1tech where the name of the game is modding and testing those mods. Not everyone who owns a LS1 is a member and or mods his/her car.
Of all the people who own an LS1 fbody I bet the number is closer to 5%. But .0000001% is IMO way too low.
I was setting the number to an extreme to make a point, but for the MASS market not the ls1tech market is isn't even close to 5%. My educated guess would be less than 1% of the total market (drag racers people). You have to remember there is a world outside of ls1tech.com (I know suprising huh?) and those are the people that buy the majority of the Camaros that GM builds. So how many people have sigs with quarter mile times isn't really all that important in the larger world that the car companies sell in.
Quote:
Originally Posted by darrensls1
Underpowered talks were partially due to GM greatly under rating the LS1 fbody. Once people started to see these cars dyno what GM said they made at the motor is when they changed thier tune. Being a solid half second quicker then the LT1 in the quarter mile didn't hurt either.
I think that this new camaro might be a tad quicker. We havn't seen the best pass yet. Once the motors break then I'm sure someone like evan smith will get a 12.7 out of one on a nice cool east coast evening. And the trap speeds have shown them to be the "faster" car even if they havn't been proven quicker yet.
Personally, I think we are going to be headed backwards soon. Obama is all ready trying to pass a minimum emmission and MPG law. I think it's a matter of time before a new generation is considerably slower because of new federal guidelines. But that's when you buy the car and do a motor swap
Again you missed my point, I said that past crowd wanted to talk down the new 4th Camaro (remember the 4th gen started with the LT1 not the LS1) just because a sense of jealousy or some kind of wanting to believe there car is the coolest of all time.
The overall point to be made is that the 5th gen Camaro is not the Camaro that has come before it, it is much more than a drag racer or even just a road racer. This is a car designed to appeal to the mass market not just a minumum of public. I myself take offense to the added weight of the lastest Camaro with the over weight wheels, a handling killer compared to lighter car with reduced unsprung weight. As to the price I see your point and go along with it in that I would prefer a car that can be ordered up stripped, but again the majority of the Camaro will be sold loaded up with heavy expensive crap so GM cateried to the mass market again.......smartly I might add. With the added tech in the New Camaro is it so unreasonable that the price should reflect the added value.
Here is the real point give this car a chance before condemming it as a slow POS.
With GM under the thumb of a bunch of pointy headed nut jobs in Washington I doubt cars like the Camaro are long for the US. Kind of funny considering before Obama ran for President he had a Hemi powered Chrysler 300 until the greenies shamed him into a hybrid, so it OK for Obama to deside what the American buying public should have to drive cause he has a Hybrid........NOW.
Funny stuff, I ve said it from day one, its a pig. Steven said over 4000 lbs with him in it, and he is way under normal. The track is 34 ft above sea level and the da was 2k feet.....wow, to me thats a dream come true. In my world, where the track is 2200 ft above sea level and the da is 4000-6500 ft it will take a power adder to get the thing in the 12's, and bolt ons to see the 13's probably.
I was setting the number to an extreme to make a point, but for the MASS market not the ls1tech market is isn't even close to 5%. My educated guess would be less than 1% of the total market (drag racers people). You have to remember there is a world outside of ls1tech.com (I know suprising huh?) and those are the people that buy the majority of the Camaros that GM builds. So how many people have sigs with quarter mile times isn't really all that important in the larger world that the car companies sell in.
We'll have to agree to disagree. These are fast muscle cars that many people have taken to a track at least once whether it's stock or not. 5% is not a high number IMO because that means 95% have never seen a drag strip. I stand by my estimation of 3-5%. Unfortunately there is no way to prove or disprove this.
So again, we'll have to agree to disagree.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 406 Q-ship
Again you missed my point, I said that past crowd wanted to talk down the new 4th Camaro (remember the 4th gen started with the LT1 not the LS1) just because a sense of jealousy or some kind of wanting to believe there car is the coolest of all time.
I don't think anyone could have an illusion of fbodies being the coolest cars of all time. Especially with the C6 Z06 Vettes out there not to mention vipers and exotics.
There are always going to be people who want to talk smack about what they can't afford. I've heard people here talk smack about Vipers and Lambos. But there is a difference between talking smack out of jelousy and simply not liking a vehicle due to looks, performance, price, ect.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 406 Q-ship
The overall point to be made is that the 5th gen Camaro is not the Camaro that has come before it, it is much more than a drag racer or even just a road racer. This is a car designed to appeal to the mass market not just a minumum of public. I myself take offense to the added weight of the lastest Camaro with the over weight wheels, a handling killer compared to lighter car with reduced unsprung weight. As to the price I see your point and go along with it in that I would prefer a car that can be ordered up stripped, but again the majority of the Camaro will be sold loaded up with heavy expensive crap so GM cateried to the mass market again.......smartly I might add. With the added tech in the New Camaro is it so unreasonable that the price should reflect the added value.
The problem with the price IMO is that it's too close to the C6 Vette. Hard to justify not spending a few grand more and getting a corvette. Even the V6's are expensive. What GM is really trying to do here is jump on the retro look bandwagon started by Ford and Dodge. I just hope it wasn't too little too late.
Besides, the success of the car does not reside in the sales of the SS. It's how well the V6 models sell that will make or break the Camaro. Hopefully they sell well and the Camaro is back to stay.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 406 Q-ship
Here is the real point give this car a chance before condemming it as a slow POS.
With GM under the thumb of a bunch of pointy headed nut jobs in Washington I doubt cars like the Camaro are long for the US. Kind of funny considering before Obama ran for President he had a Hemi powered Chrysler 300 until the greenies shamed him into a hybrid, so it OK for Obama to deside what the American buying public should have to drive cause he has a Hybrid........NOW.
I'm not against the car. I just wish they had not given it IRS, made it weigh close to 4000 lbs and used 20" wheels. But I like the motor, tranny and looks. But I all ready know I'll never own one. If I'm gonna spend that kind of cash then I'm getting a slightly used c6 Vette. What a gorgeous car that is
__________________ 1999 Pontiac Firebird Formula ("The Chicken Hawk")
Streetsweeper cam (236/240 112 lsa), Fast 90 intake, NW TB, Lucas 42# injectors, Powerbond underdrive pulley, TSP lid, FRA, Dynomouth exhaust, Pacesetter LT headers, ORY, Circle-D 5C 4400 stall, Performabuilt level 3 4L60E, B&M 24K transmission cooler, Motive 4.10 gears & Dyno Tuned by Mike @ New Era Performance
First off, I was hoping the 5th gen would blow the doors off the 4th gen too. But you can't have everything, maybe the 6th gen will be based on a smaller chasis and GM can shed some weight. But how many stock, and I mean bone stock to the paper filter LS2s ran 12's in good weather conditions?
Now someone please show me all of the 12-second bone stcok LS1 (4th gen) timeslips that were run in at least 80-degrees and at least 80% humidity that broke into the 12's. Because I must haved missed them...back in the day the best times at my local track for LS1s were 12.8-12.9 with CAI (not stock) and that is in good, cold, dry weather. Wait until the fall when the 5th gen has this type of weather and I think we're going to start seeing much better runs.
__________________ 1993 Z28 A4, Yank SY3500, Dynatech LTs, SLP catback, Moroso intake, Crane 227, CSI waterpump....and more 2010 SS A6, tuned by Diablosport
I had a chance to drive a 2010 L99 Camaro this last week. I was very skeptical of the weight of the car and the wheels. I was wrong........very wrong, GM has done an awesome job of hiding the 3900 pounds, these cars are f'ing ROCKETS! Handling is superb, the IRS will take abuse no past Camaro or Mustang (car and driver is so wrong) can even think about and keep composure. I drove a 98 Z28 when they first hits the streets (quick and fun), the 2010 will kill the LS1 car, the old car isn't even in the same zip code when it comes to performance (lifes roads are not straight and 1/4 mile at a time). If I did not have the 2 cars I currently have, I would be at the dealership ordering a SS with a M6. I may put an LS3 in my Monte Carlo after feeling the thrust that L99 delivered.
This the Camaro GM should have built 20 years ago.
I was searching for some good times for these cars since somebody I knew bought one here locally in Canada. He's claiming a mid 12 second timeslip stock on 20" street tires at 35psi.. I can't find another Camaro this fast anywhere.. so far so I just thought I'd post the timeslip on this site.. I really can't say for sure, but I'm wondering if the one on the right is the Camaro, instead of the left Lol.. I guess we'll see next time we meet at the track, which unfortunately would be sometime next year.. he's planning on forced induction though and just did this run for a baseline to compare to his future mods.
I was skeptical of the new Camaro but raced my buddies M6 a few weeks ago. We went from a 70 roll which is a very bad speed for me as I have to hit 3rd instead of 2nd, but oh well. He instantly pulled between 1 and 2 cars on me. I stopped his pull when I shifted into 4th but really couldn't gain any back. I think I was gaining slowly but hard to tell when your concentrating on the road at those speeds.
I have 341 hp 355 tq on mustang dyno and M6 with only 17k miles on the clock. Needless to say I was very impressed, much faster car than I thought and good build quality.
