Smaller diameter LS3 flywheel

matoakley · 09-05-2009, 06:02 AM

Hi

I am replacing my rover V8 (Old buick lump). I have bought an LS3 and TKo600 which I hope will make 1000kg of TVR move. The engine is drysumped.

Biggest problem is that LS3 flywheel is huge 14 inch (168 tooth) This limits how low I can put engine in chasis. Is there a smaller diameter flywheel and matching starter that will fit?
I note that the adverts for 2010 camaro say it has a 290mm flywheel
Any help gratefully recieved

Matthew

Dan_W · 09-05-2009, 06:06 PM

McLeod makes a 153 tooth flywheel and starter (together about $800).

matoakley · 09-06-2009, 05:15 AM

Thank you I will give them a ring. Thats about an inch smaller isnt it

Matthew

Dan_W · 09-06-2009, 10:37 AM

Just measured mine, flywheel surface is roughly 12 1/2" diameter, 12 7/8" for the ring gear. They make a steel one and a lightweight aluminum one. If you use their starter, you can't use the dip stick hole in the block... you'd have to go with a gto style pan to keep a dip stick. I modified one of the square style mini starters instead of using McLeods... it just barely allows the dip stick.

matoakley · 09-07-2009, 07:05 AM

Thank you Dan

Good news, dip stick not a problem as engine drysumped. You don't perhaps have a record of part numbers as I am struggling to find from UK.

Many thanks Mat

Dan_W · 09-07-2009, 10:04 AM

I encourage you to talk to Red Roberts at McLeod. He is the owner I think... and he is the one that managed the small flywheel project for the LS motor. There are other parts your going to need other than the flywheel and starter. You're also going to need some sort of pilot bushing, the correct clutch and hyd TO bearing (or maybe an adjustable ball stud). What bellhousing and trans are you using? You may not have all the info you need for the TO bearing/pilot bushing until after you get your flywheel/clutch/tranny mocked up.

Here is the flywheel I ordered:
Flywheel MCL-460575 $398.34 (summitracing.com part number)

This is essentially a neutral balanced flywheel from the newer style small block chevy with the one piece rear main seal but its been drilled for the LS crank Flange. This part number is for the steel one, not sure of the weight off hand but probably about 40lbs. Again, they also make an aluminum one. I think they come standard drilled for a GM 10 1/2" clutch (like 1990 chevy camaro 5.0L v8) but I had them set mine up for the stock type ford mustang style clutch since thats the tranny I'm using (yes the stock clutch fits and clears everything). Mine came delivered for both patterns. Red also offered other options for the clutch, including a slightly larger one but I was concerned about my bellhousing clearance. In other words, you need to talk to McLeod because I'm not sure what clutch the flywheel will be drilled for if you order my part number. It might be either or both GM/Ford with 10 1/2 clutch/Pressure plate.

Reds starter part number is 8101701. I didn't order this through summit so I'm not sure if they have it added to their parts catalog. McLeods list price on it was $350 but from summit it will be less (the flywheel was $50 less). If summit doesnt have it listed, just talk to the customer service guys to get it listed. They can get it done the same business day.

FYI, Since I was digging into part numbers, this is the starter I modified to work: to make it fit, I had to cut a bunch of material off its mounting block and TIG welded 1/4" plates to the top and bottom with the correct bolt hole locations. This let me keep my dipstick.
Starter SUM-820323 $161.90 Summit

A couple of other companies that might have parts that you may need:
Wilcap.com and AdvanceAdapters.com.

matoakley · 09-07-2009, 02:19 PM

Thanks again Dan Excellent

I have TKO 600 and bellhousing to fit to LS3. It normally uses McCleod 11"clutch. And I have mechanism for that.

I may have to go twin plate esp if increase power as perhaps marginal with 10.5 ". I need clutch and Flywheel to be light as possible so could go smaller diameter.

I will speak to Red Roberts

Thanks for all the help.

Matthew

Dan_W · 09-07-2009, 08:34 PM

Out of curiosity, wont that TKO bellhousing take a 168 tooth flywheel? It would save a whole lot of headache if you could use one.

Project GatTagO · 09-07-2009, 09:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by matoakley

Hi

I am replacing my rover V8 (Old buick lump). I have bought an LS3 and TKo600 which I hope will make 1000kg of TVR move. The engine is drysumped.

Biggest problem is that LS3 flywheel is huge 14 inch (168 tooth) This limits how low I can put engine in chasis. Is there a smaller diameter flywheel and matching starter that will fit?
I note that the adverts for 2010 camaro say it has a 290mm flywheel
Any help gratefully recieved

Matthew

I think the Camaro uses 290mm clutch disk. That would make the flywheel the stock 14 inch diameter (168 tooth).

Andrew

matoakley · 09-09-2009, 06:25 PM

HI

Yes bell housing will take 168 tooth but then engine almost an inch higher than needs to be, If I use 153 then bell housing will be modified.

I was doing searches to find smaller flywheel and found several press releases suggesting 2010 camaro will have 290 Flywheel, perhaps miss print

Thanks again

Matthew

matoakley · 09-21-2009, 07:09 PM

Thank you again Dan. Flywheel and starter now sorted.

I was planning to chop bottom off bellhousing. But have had another thought. Will SB bellhousings fit LS3 ? if so Quick time do one that fits tightly to 153 tooth Flywheel.
I understand that LS3 flywheel face is 400thou different in position than SB. Is it closer to block?
If so I would just have to space out Hydraulic thrust Bearing.

Does this sound reasonable?

Thanks again Matthew

serpentnoir · 09-22-2009, 01:58 PM

Have you looked at a rear mounted starter? They use much smaller flywheels but you have to buy a bellhousing specifically designed for it. something like this:

matoakley · 09-23-2009, 03:44 AM

Oh Yes thats what I wanted! Bit late now as I have special bits including 153 tooth LS flywheel and custom made starter.

Is that an LS kit you have sent picture of?

serpentnoir · 09-23-2009, 08:56 AM

I think that is just a generic picture. Sonic and Tilton make these. Possibly others too. The picture above is from HRPworld.com

Be forewarned, they are expensive but you do get a complete setup: housing, clutch, flexplate, starter.

chris-m · 09-23-2009, 10:54 AM

Mat
might be worth you having a chat with andy burrows at Gardner Douglas in the UK (01949843299)
GD use the LS series engines in their kit cars, i got all my bits from him. they have bellhousings/adaptors etc for the TKO boxes and porsche G50 boxes and have hydraulic clutch adaptors/starters motors/ring gear etc all sorted to suit. we use a small custom made flywheel from GD along with a Super clutch triple plate 7 1/4" clutch rated to about 500ft/lb plus.
it may be he can help with off the shelf bits as they have worked with all the LS series engines, worth a call maybe
good luck with the project

matoakley · 09-24-2009, 06:52 PM

Thank you Chris

Yes I have had some bits from him and he was generally very helpful. Unfortunately not quite what was needed in this case

matthew

Dan_W · 09-27-2009, 07:45 PM

Sorry for the late reply... yes the small block chevy bellhousings will bolt to the LS motors. The LS motors move one bolt hole from the 1-oclock position to the 12-oclock position. So when you use the small block bell on the LS, you can only use 5 bolt holes. Its generally not considered to be an issue.

Of course you'll still have to worry about the input shaft lenth, pilot bushing engagement and diameter, TO bearing gemoetry, Bearing retainer to index hole fit, etc.

My setup that is mocked up but not in the car yet uses the LS block with a 1980 AMC spirit Bellhousing (from 2.5l 4cyl motor), a ford z-spec fox mustang version T-5 with the bearing retainer turned down a few thousaths to fit the index hole in the bell. Pilot bushing was from advanced adapters, stock AMC TO bearing and fork, Home made adjustable ball stud, Mcleod 153 tooth flywheel, my own modified starter and a Ford Style 10.5" clutch / pressure plate and the stock (I modified) AMC Slave Cyl.