NovaKid

October 23, 2010

Hey everyone, I decided to do an LS6 Swap into my 1963 Nova so I figured I'd document it on here. I've found all the LS tech-ers on this website to be very helpful and by posting this thread, maybe I can help out someone else out down the road.

I imagine this whole install and thread will take me about 6 months to a year to complete. I'm a Mechanical Engineering college student that is often short on time and money, so I will update this thread as often as possible.

As the car sits, I have previously installed a TCI front clip several years ago. It's got a built 85' S-10 rear end in it (since they are pretty narrow) with 3.73's. Stock mono-leafs with Caltracs bars and subframe connectors. I just pulled out my old 350 SBC and I'm starting to collect parts for this swap.

Can't wait to get going on it! Here are a few pics:

Don't be fooled, it's probably a "20 footer"



Got a pretty sweet deal on a new 03' LS6 motor. It's like a good looking girl...I couldn't say no.





October 28, 2010

Well, the first order of business was to install a pair of motor mount adapter plates to relocate the mounts on the engine. I’m using 3/8 in steel adapter plates that have been powdercoated, I just hope I don’t have any alignment issues with the mounts when I install the engine (shouldn’t be a problem, but I will see when the time comes).

UPDATE: February 19, 2011: I Purchased some CBR Headers and they came with 1/4" steel motor mount plates. I ended up using these motor mount relocation plates because I had some trouble aligning the engine with the 3/8" plates. My motor mount bolts slid right in with the 1/4" plates.



Next, I had to start thinking about the front dress. I didn’t know whether my harmonic balancer came from a truck, f-body, or vette so here is an easy way to tell: If the balancer is installed on the engine, measure from the front cover to the front of the balancer. If 2 1/8 inches, then it’s a Corvette Balancer. If 2 15/16 inches, then it’s a Camaro Balancer. If 3 11/16, then it’s a truck balancer. If the balancer isn’t on the engine, then the measurements would be: 3 7/16, 3 13/16 and 4 3/8 inches, respectively (measuring the depth of the whole pulley/balancer).

I wanted to run the low-mount F-body alternator setup and luckily, the F-body balancer came with my engine so I was safe there. From the crank, I am only running the water pump and alternator so I snooped around the LS1 Tech site and found this setup, which is absolutely great for my application: https://ls1tech.com/forums/new-ls1-o...-steering.html I have talked to several people about this pulley setup and everyone says they have never had a problem.



Time to deal with the oil pan clearance situation. After I took some measurements and asked around, the cadillac CTS-V oil pan (that came with my engine) definitely does not fit the aftermarket TCI front end. I ordered up an F-body oil pan, windage tray, oil pump pick-up, dipstick, dipstick tube and an extra oil pump pickup seal just in case I pinched the seal when installing it. I re-used all the existing nuts and bolts since the only torque-to-yield bolts are the crank and head bolts.

Caddy Pan







F-body pan on the right, CTS-V pan on the left.



I would have installed the oil filter from the Caddy pan, but for some reason it didn't fit. I thought there was something wrong with the threads on the F-Body oil filter fitting, but it turns out that GM ran out of LS1/LS6 oil filter fitttings for replacement oil pans so they began installing the LS7 oil filter fitting. If this ever happens to you, get a filter for a 2008 LS7 vette.



As you can see from this photo, I have a sway bar behind the crossmember (crap!). I bought and installed my aftermarket TCI front end a while back and that is where they placed the sway bar. Since then, TCI has come out with another sway bar kit that replaces the old sway bar with a new one that mounts to the base of the down-tube supports in front of the crossmember (involves drilling through the subframe to accommodate an extra bolt on each side). I’ll be installing the new sway bar soon.






November 13, 2010

I'm back at it. I installed the new swaybar from TCI. You can see where I drilled through the frame to accommodate the extra bolts on the far right and left of the photo. Now, I have the clearance I need behind the crossmember for the F body oil pan.



Pulled out my old TH350 Trans, sitting on the right. I'll be looking for a 4L60E in the near future.



I set the engine in the car just to check for any clearance issues. The swaybar and alternator fit well. I checked the motor mounts and they line up okay, but not great. I was able to slide one bolt in on the passenger side, but the drivers side is going to be a little bit of a pain down the road. Here are some more pics:







That's pretty freakin' close batman, but I think the pan will have enough clearance once I install a tranny since the rear of the engine will lean back more, bringing the front up.

99ssleeper

iTrader: (98)

Looking good, it will be a fun project! Im in the middle of a swap myself but using a '00 LS1/4L60e and a stock clip with CBR suspension/rack. Its good to see another Nova on the site. Are you on StevesNovaSite as well?

NovaKid

Hey thanks! I do have an account on StevesNovaSite, but I find most of my answers on this forum. I've snooped around on threads over there and it seems like people are always sending the LS guys over here. Eventually, I'll probably end up copying this thread and putting it in StevesNovaSite too.

Like the wagon! It'll definitely be a sleeper! I bet that stock front end makes things challenging!!

99ssleeper

iTrader: (98)

Actually surprisingly no, nothing seems to be a problem. Everything clears, even the alternator and a/c compressor are in the stock fbody location (low on the sides) and nothing hits. I had an offer to trade the CBR/QA1/rack setup for a TCI clip but decided to stay with the stock clip and this suspension just for originality sake.

TomM

iTrader: (56)

Great build plans, keep us posted....you are gonna love the LS platform.....

T,

NovaKid

I am surprised! That's good to hear it's working out! Good luck with your swap and keep the LS crowd posted.

That's funny you commented. I have read your thread several times these past few months (bookmarked it). Your thread is what motivated me to do the same! I'm sure I'm saying what you've already been told, but great info on your thread and that is one sweet nova!!

TomM

iTrader: (56)

The title of the thread caught my eye......all things Nova right......

I really had a blast doing the swap, and learning the new technology.....so much I am building another one.....

Post plenty of pictures, that Chevy 2 is going haul *** with that LS6........

If you have any questions, please feel free to ask.....

Thanks for the compliment...

T,

Chevy406

iTrader: (12)

+1 for a fellow Mechanical Engineer, LSx Nova builder... Your starting with a nice solid platform with that '63 and you will love the LS6. I have always been an old school muscle car guy until I bought a daily driver C5 Corvette and started modifying it. Got it up to 470 rwhp without even taking the short block out of the car. That was more whp than the solid roller, Brodix head 406 SBC in my Nova. So, now I am in the process of adding a 408 iron block LSx with a couple turbos to boot. If you find something that TomM can't answer there are several other LSX Nova builds on this forum that may be able to help. But so far Tom appears to have the LS conversion covered well.

66 NOVA

Good Luck on your build, sounds like a nice one!

i885744

Do you know what year the motor is? If its an 01, its not as much power as the 02+. What do you plan on doing for an ecu, wiring, and headers?

NovaKid

My motor is an '03 rated at 405hp. I have a brand new ecu that I'll probably get re-flashed...eventually.

As for the wiring, I am going to bite the bullet and purchase the wiring harness from Street and Performance with the necessary deleted wiring components (smog crap, rear O2 sensors, etc). There is a guy, Tom, who did his own wiring harness and I remember him mentioning something like it was a nightmare/very tedious. Here's the link: http://www.stevesnovasite.com/forums...d.php?t=152458 He is very knowledgeable about everything to do with an LS nova conversion.

I'll pay extra to avoid the extra time and frustration going through a vette harness wire by wire.

For headers, There are 3 companies currently making them for this application (as far as I know). S & P sells the coated shorty/mid-length headers, CBR sells stainless long tube, and BRP rods has the coated long tube headers. Here's a link: https://ls1tech.com/forums/conversio...g-mock-up.html From what I've seen, BRP seems like they have the best value for your buck.

i885744

Sounds like you've done your homework.

You might have to get the ecu flashed just to bypass the VATS depending on your harness. I had a painless harness for an LS1 with the "VATS disable" chip, which flat out did not disable the VATS. The car wouldn't run (would start then immediately kill itself) until after I had the thing sent out. You want it flashed anyway since you're going to run headers and no cats.

That 4l60e is going to be a bit longer than your sbc/th350 combo. You very likely are going to have to move your crossmember backwards and of course get the driveshaft shortened. Do you have that all figured out yet?

Just noticed you are doing throttle by cable. Is that correct for an 03 LS6? I thought all the LS6's/Vettes were throttle by wire. Is this one of those weird LS1's in the F bodies where they ran out of LS1 parts and had to use LS6 components?

rick64ss

some good info

NovaKid

I'll definitely keep that in mind when I have the ecu flashed. Thank you for the "heads up" on that one.

The 4L60E is longer, but BRP makes a kit for that as well (luckily, it fits in the stock trans tunnel without a problem). If you click on the BRP header link above and go through a couple pages on that thread, they just came out with a new trans crossmember for 62-67 novas (should be a pic). I need to call them and get some more info on it since it is a kit (with headers, etc). I don't know whether I'm going to get a new driveshaft or have mine shortened.

You are correct on the throttle by wire. The 97-04 vettes came with a throttle by wire, but they can be converted to throttle by cable because they have a 24 tooth reluctor wheel (for the crank sensor). If you have a 58 tooth reluctor wheel, which came in later engines, then it CAN'T be converted to throttle by cable without some crazy modification. From what I have read, an easy way to tell what reluctor wheel you have is to look at the color of the crank sensor on the outside of the block: Black = 24 tooth, Gray = 58 tooth.

I ended up getting the cable setup off a GTO... forgot what year it was.

Have a good one! Hope that helps

i885744

Since you're getting the ecu done, you should probably think about getting a cam too. They are cheap, you'll already have the motor out and you can get a decent performance boost without having to do any head work as long as you get a semi-mild one. It is technically possible to put a cam in n ls1 without yanking the heads if you know the right tricks. Then you might be able to keep up with your friends Yea right.

NovaKid

I think I'm going to hold off on the cam. By the time I'm done, I'll have a bazillion dollars in it. Say, if I had an El Camino (spanish for "the camino") with a big block in it, I would have to spend a bazillion dollars X 2, b/c everyone knows big blocks are twice as expensive and I don't have that kind of money... unless... I can get a bailout from the gov't!! Freakin' genius! That's what I'll do. Thanks Mike, you're always very helpful.

i885744

Any time, Pat. The PARTS are twice as expensive, but the initial buy in for a good used big block, is WAY less than an LS series motor, and you dont have to screw with computers or wiring or efi. That stuff all adds up. Any time you need help, you know where I am. I pay your salary anyway, so I should get to decide how you spend it!

TomM

iTrader: (56)

What year ECM do you have......

As far as the harness, check out Techrods, built to suit, and will save you a few hundred over S&P......email general@techrods.com Shane will walk you through what you want.

Posted a question on the BRP kit thread for 1st and 2nd Gen Nova, don't think their headers are going to clear the steering shaft......if you look at S&P, and CBR, note how the #1 tube makes the turn......has to do that to clear the steering shaft......

T,

NovaKid

That is a good question Tom. I'll have to look into that. It's a brand new ecm, but I'm not sure what year it is.

Techrods huh? Sounds like I'll be giving them some business in the next 6-8 months. Do they do ecm flashing too? Thanks again!

I called BRP hotrods today and talked to the owner, Phil. He said the same thing about the steering shaft. He mentioned that he was going to make a kit that would accommodate aftermarket front ends. Also, aftermarket motor mount adapters may not work since his kit was based around the stock front end and different motor mounts that come in his kit.

Do you have any suggestions about headers and 4L60E transmission mounts? I saw that S&P sold trans mounts too. What did you use for the trans mount or did you make your own? Thank you for your help Tom!

i885744

These supposedly will fit, ls1 on an aftermarket clip like pats.

http://www.schoenfeldheaders.com/LS1-STREET.htm Part # 186Ls1-3

Here are some pictures of them in an ls1 nova with aftermarket clip.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/album.php?albumid=12972

Looks like its REALLY close on the steering shaft, i had the same problem in the Camaro. I ended up cutting my shaft, and mounting another universal to the subframe to stop it from rubbing/denting the headers.