this is why i got the billets, and had convos before...
__________________ 02 z28 A4 Stock Internal with SS3600 11.558 at 116.24 MPH 1.546 60ft DA -832 11/25/07 Cam Only and SS4000 10.617 at 124.66MPH 1.356 DA -870ft Race weight 3250lbs
ram air info with ac http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/genera...r-install.html
without ac see post 5, pm me if you need one
First off, we do not like to see any failures. I'm not in here to make excuses.
As mentioned, there is always more to a story.
The original poster purchased the vehicle used.
The wheels came with the car.
The shop that built/sold the car has not purchased wheels in over 4 years. This meant the wheels are over 4 years old. These may be even older. We/poster both have no idea.
The poster has no history of past usage as they were purchased with the car.
We offered to look at the wheels and possibly repair them, he declined stating he only wanted us to send new wheels as they shouldn't have broken.
Racing parts do not last forever, components fail, parts break. These are things that are part of hard run cycled components.
We have one of the best warranty programs in the wheel business.
this is why i got the billets, and had convos before...
If you wanted street/strip wheels (not drag wheels) we have them and building them for years, the older ones we built is VERY similar to how Billet makes them now (they are using the same shells). We changed for various reasons.
Our new street/strip F-body wheels utilize a new design using higher grade superior material. They have a 3 year warranty. They are lighter than billets by quite a bit and both our front and rear wheels fit without modifications...unlike Billets.
Billet wheels break too. I've seen them crack. If you'd like to see a picture of one, I can post it too.
I'm not knocking their wheels, they are nice. My point in commenting to your post was that you purchased a completely different style non drag wheel and you're assuming your wheel is bulletproof.
IMO based on not knowing the past history of the wheels with the previous owner, it's nobody's fault, and Bogart shouldn't be expected to deliver new wheels because this one broke.
I'd be mad too, but, we just don't know how they were treated before.
Side note - why does it say that these wheels should not be on a vehilce that is being towed? I was just curious what might cause failures on the wheel from towing, that you wouldn't see on a race car? the side loading?
__________________ 1987 Chevy Iroc-Z28 - clean and original
2002 Pontiac WS6 - "stock"
2007 C6 Z51 - ECS Car - 730rwhp
2008 HHR SS - 320hp 33mpg DD
Its a chance you take with lightweight welded wheels, notice most 'race' rear wheels bolt together and the super light fronts are billet.
I like Bogarts, they are a high quality wheel and look fantastic but I was always a little nervous about the welded Bogarts I had on my 8 second car after seeing a few failures on the internet.
But Steve is right, I bought my old Bogarts used (and it looked like one was welded/repaired in the center), I beat the living shit out of those things, hundreds of 1.2x 60 foots, nasty ass drag radial tire chatter, 7' wheel stands etc and they never broke. I sold them super cheap and made it pretty clear they were well used, but they still looked like new. Buying used lightweight race wheels is like buying a used condom. You may get lucky and it works, or you may get a an unforeseen surprise if it doesnt
This makes me nervous running Bogarts. I know theres probably more to the story, but still
Restating post:
…After some investigation.
First off, we do not like to see any failures. I'm not in here to make excuses.
As mentioned, there is always more to a story.
The original poster purchased the vehicle used.
The wheels came with the car.
The shop that built/sold the car has not purchased wheels in over 4 years. This meant the wheels are over 4 years old. These may be even older. We/poster both have no idea.
The poster has no history of past usage as they were purchased with the car.
We offered to look at the wheels and possibly repair them, he declined stating he only wanted us to send new wheels as they shouldn't have broken.
Racing parts do not last forever, components fail, parts break. These are things that are part of hard run cycled components.
We have one of the best warranty programs in the wheel business.
Kp, You've had a good experience with the your wheels, most people do. On ocassion, sometimes parts can break/fail. It is inevitable. Unfortunitly, some people generally post bad experiences instead of the 1000's of good ones.
Case in point, the poster received the wheels second hand with the car he purchased yet was upset posting that we wouldn't replace them as a warranty failure. First, most manufactures don't transfer warranties, neither do we, I'm not even considering the fact they were over 4 years old. THe poster nor do we know what the wheels went through.
We were willing to fix them, but he apparantly wanted no part of it. I understand someone can be upset about a part breaking but to be upset and make a post like this is not the right thing to do. He does have the right to post what he feels, I am bringing to air the full picture.
So what would cause more wear & tear on a wheel. Big HP and big speed, or bigger wheelies, but less HP & speed.
My car only lifts the front a few inches, carry's them quite a way and gently set's them down.
I actually can't do a wheelie if I wanted to with a 8 1/2 foot wheelie bar.
Is there a life cycle based on time or number of pass' for fronts and backs.
I can't even imagine what mine cost now, but at my speeds, better safe than sorry.
I know mine are ~8 years old. Thanks,
.
__________________
Used BBC-Dragrace-Trucks-Trailers 4 sale, private party personal items only. Parts For Sale**Added stuff 4 sale**
"Testing-Kind of boring, No N2O, only 1.10's 60 footers" Click here to see Video . .Pictures of '70 1/2 Rally Sport Photo's For my babies, we will always remember In memory of Chris Costa, you will never meet a nicer guy. I will never forget your kindness, when I needed it.
I put like 15,000 miles on a set of Weld Draglite fronts. I have friends who have had the same set of Draglite fronts for like 10 years.
Those Bogarts always split the same way when you see a post, they split in half like that. The whole thing about only running ET Fronts is weird to me, most of the tires I've run in front are all around the same psi rating. Not like I ran tires that needed to be at 60psi. It's to me just the case that the wheel can fail fail with extended street driving.
So let me get this straight. OP buys car used, with wheels, not knowing any history of them, how old they are, how many street driven miles were on them, and one breaks and he wants a free replacement!?
LOL. Sign me up for that deal.
Steve, If I buy a used set of 5 year old Bogarts on craigslist and I break one, you're going to send me a new one, right?
__________________
LOW-TECH RACING NBM Camaro Z28
Mineral Grey SVT Cobra
So let me get this straight. OP buys car used, with wheels, not knowing any history of them, how old they are, how many street driven miles were on them, and one breaks and he wants a free replacement!?
LOL. Sign me up for that deal.
Steve, If I buy a used set of 5 year old Bogarts on craigslist and I break one, you're going to send me a new one, right?
Camaro396: That's pretty much in a nutshell. We did offer to repair it, but he declined.
Prostock John: we do not advocate radials such as the VW tire. We suggest tire such as a MTT-1573 or the MTT-3007. Those VW’s generally are not load rated and are designed for larger width wheels. Stuffing a stiff tire designed for a 5-6" wheel on a 3.5" wheel and overinflating so the tire doesn't look like its running flat is a recipe for failure. Front radials are not recommended for our drag wheels. They are much stiffer and can actually work-harden the material rather easy.
...We’ve got guys running our wheels for excess of 10, 15 years as well. For example, when you see the Monocoque wheel (our Bogart wheels under another name…it’s our Bogart Prostar), those use thinner shells and designed to be lighter than the pieces you see on the F-bodes now…which hasn’t been produced for almost 15 years…and still being used.
mrdragster1970: stress and cycling is a concern for any drag component (no matter what it is. There are too many variables to state you need to change them within X years. You should daily inspect the wheels before using them. Weld warranties their pro series wheels for only 30 days, yes only 30 days per their website. We guarantee all our drag wheels for 1 year. A 7 year old drag wheel punished at the level of your car is probably worth considering replacement. Just as you need to freshen an engine up as parts are stressed, wheels are no different.
DanZ28: if I post a picture, it’s not to change the posters original topic. It’s also NOT to state their wheels are terrible or don’t purchase them. It is purely to show you that even a street/strip wheel breaks, remember, those are NOT drag wheels. They use the same manufacture shells that we’ve used for our old street/strip 2 piece wheels so I am familiar with the design…and yes those shells we used have broke too! This is also not to state the shells are bad either. Our new F-body Street/strip wheels are a 3 piece design user higher grade material and use bolted centers and are guaranteed for 3 years. They are designed for street/strip use. They are NOT a drag wheel.
Last edited by SJM Manufacturing Inc; 09-11-2009 at 10:58 AM..
Used BBC-Dragrace-Trucks-Trailers 4 sale, private party personal items only. Parts For Sale**Added stuff 4 sale**
"Testing-Kind of boring, No N2O, only 1.10's 60 footers" Click here to see Video . .Pictures of '70 1/2 Rally Sport Photo's For my babies, we will always remember In memory of Chris Costa, you will never meet a nicer guy. I will never forget your kindness, when I needed it.
Per Dan's request: Billet lite wheel. For all, please read my above disclaimer regarding Dan's request.
Thanks Steve. I really just wanted to see where and how it cracked since I run those billet wheels myself. That pic looks like it tore away. Do you know how it happened?
__________________ New Setup = Money Pit from hell!
Had a Bogart break on me years ago and lucky for me I was only going 10mph.
I would NEVER put them on any car I drive. If that rim had came apart at 150mph I might not be here today. You guys are risking your cars at best and this guy says "well you have to check stuff on an 8 second car" thats B/S I dont check my Alumastars I know they wont fall apart from a crappy weld job.
I'm not the only one ... do a search on the internet.
I had a welded r/t front split the same way...It happened going about 25 mph on the street...I think the wheel was 1 year old and I bought them new...Those who know me know that I take impeccable care of my stuff, too..I didnt drive the car much on the street with those wheels but thought that at almost $1500/set that I'd be ok...I was told that the wheel failed because of my 165 R15 radials that I was running...I have been racing for over 20 years and have used that tire size on every skinny I've ever had from Welds to Ceneterlines to Wheel Vintiques all were much cheaper and I never ever had a wheel failure...Now I did receive a free wheel replacement which was very nice, but I did sell them because I was simply scared to have the wheel fall apart at 120 plus mph at the track...
I just couldn't get past the fact that the most expensive wheels I ever purchased failed...They are a great looking wheel, but I'll admire them on someone elses car...
--Alan
__________________ 1995 Formula A4 Baby Cammed 383
11.23 @ 121.18 w/ 1.52 60' N/A on 275 60 R15 DRs
Thanks to LPE, PAF, FBC, Joe O., & E.B. Porting
You're welcome. That's the second one that I know broke from them. That one, the guy said he was just driving when it broke if I'm not mistaken. That's all I know. As mentioned, I've seen those shells fail before so it's not new news to me. Those shells are purchased from a shell supplier Billet doesn't manufacure them, they build the centers (I believe) and weld them to the shells. Once again, for others reading, they are not bad wheels, it can happen though.
I recall your transaction. We did replace the wheel for you, which was something I authorized as we normally wouldn't do so when you use a tire that is NOT designed for the wheel...You can't expect to put a tire not rated for a DRAG wheel and expect it to last....AND drive it on the street. The other wheels you're discussing would not be considered the same class of drag wheel...now the alumastars are in the same class. Actually, I recall most damages as we have so few. Almost all of the fronts (which is about 90% are either damaged from wrecks or guys using those cheap radials). I would not tell our customers NOT to run the VW tires for the heck of it. We don't sell tires, so we have nothing to gain from recommending the correct type of tire.
If I'm not mistaken, Alumastar 2's are actually more expensive then our welded version wheels. Quite a bit more actually. So if you have alumstars (which are very nice wheels) you spent quite a bit more money. You also have a wheel that I'd never consider using on the street.
If you missed my comment, we're replacing/repairing a shell on an Alumastar RIGHT now as the customer broke his and Weld denied repair/replacing them (according the the customer). They are also warranted for only 30 days whereas ours are for 1 year.
I'd feel confident stating using an alumastar on the street will bend/break much quicker than our welded wheels designed for the F-body. I'd like you to put the VW radial tire on the street with an alumastar and see how long it lasts. Do it within the 30 day warranty.
When you purchase a cheaper wheel, that doesn't mean its going to be weaker...it means its probably made from lessor expensive materials and is heavier.
Every drag wheel manufacture has wheel failures, no one likes to see them. There's many brands documented on here that fail.
Last edited by SJM Manufacturing Inc; 09-11-2009 at 06:04 PM..
383,stock head, carbed
