I dont like most T/A's out there, my car launches best lower then those allow... Might be worth looking into.... I run 12 psi too its hitting them too hard and unloading, TA probably has to drop more, imo...
Do you have any pics of your front t/a mount? Does it keep the tires planted longer now? I've tried playing with the lca angle also, but whenever I move them up a hole, all the traction is completely lost and it just spins and never does "load".
your car is hitting the tires too hard, and unloading. If you would slow mo that second video for another 10 seconds i bet we could see that. You can see it starting to unload the tires in that second vid big time. If you could get it to hit the tire softer and keep the weight transfered, your 60 times would improve drastically
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by SlowFRC
I'm bored so I'm going to translate:
Does your mother know that they voted you a nutswinger who lurks and then kicks people in the nuts because you're gay and a white dude who jumps around so GTFO because im funny and I'm winking at you so GTFO, if you do i'll smile and nod my head and laugh.....
Hmmm, still a terrible string of insults if you ask me.
Do you have any pics of your front t/a mount? Does it keep the tires planted longer now? I've tried playing with the lca angle also, but whenever I move them up a hole, all the traction is completely lost and it just spins and never does "load".
Mike
It's got 4 adjustment holes, right now its 1 up from the bottom.
Its all 4130, and stronger then anything I am currently aware of, 1 5/8, 1 1/2, 1 3/8 and 1 1/4 tubing and a .75 inch "a" gusset.
I also custom made the 1.25" double adjuster.
__________________ 10.95 @ 125.61 1.46 60', best 60' 1.42 Granny shifting 2000 SS 6 speed Patriot Heads/ torquer II/ MONSTER Clutch (Stock pistons Not flycut, stock bearings, stock crank, stock rods, stock oil pump, stock main caps, ARP rodbolts!!!) 439 rwhp/ 394 trq Mustang Dyno Tuned By Brian @ Kaltechwww.kaltechtuning.com H/C combo for sale:http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/lsx-pa...sec-combo.html
your car is hitting the tires too hard, and unloading. If you would slow mo that second video for another 10 seconds i bet we could see that. You can see it starting to unload the tires in that second vid big time. If you could get it to hit the tire softer and keep the weight transfered, your 60 times would improve drastically
I already know what it's doing. Tell me how to fix it and then I'll be impressed.
your car is hitting the tires too hard, and unloading. If you would slow mo that second video for another 10 seconds i bet we could see that. You can see it starting to unload the tires in that second vid big time. If you could get it to hit the tire softer and keep the weight transfered, your 60 times would improve drastically
x2 for sure ^
keep the lcas on the lowest setting and give that tq arm more angle try atleast 2*..Also give the tire atleast 12.5 psi, remember you changed the rear dramatically and it might like something else now....Then post up a vid on that 2nd one and show atleast 5 secs so we can see what else its doing...if you can.
all the traction is completely lost and it just spins and never does "load".
Mike
Your car isn't working in unison at all, your wheel is on the way up before the weight even starts to move. You said you have the comp. engineering rear shocks. What setting are they on?
What do you have for front shocks?
Edit: I just saw your other thread where your tire size is listed as 26/10.5/15 ET streets. You don't have a whole lot of sidewall to give your car time to react but there's still something wrong with this suspension setup. Your rear shouldn't move that much before the car. I think it goes with badss is saying about torque arm placement. The TA should get the weight transfering much earlier than it is. Your car is basically doing a skateboard ollie because the tires are coming down and up so fast. You need to slow the wheel drop down either with more tire pressure or taller tires. More pressure in these tires can work if you get the rest of the suspension to do it's job.
__________________ Kaltech Tuning and Performance http://www.kaltechtuning.com/
17 North Belle Mead Rd.
Setauket, NY 11733
V. 631 242-6444
F. 631 242-6445
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Last edited by Kaltech Tuning; 10-27-2009 at 09:15 AM..
What are the settings on the control arm brackets? Answer me that and then I can point you in the direction for the torque arm.
__________________ 1999 Z28 M6, C5R timing chain, K&N Filter, Spiffy Black Seats, 1OTL, BPU+++
2006 Duramax 3500 DRW Crew
Edge juice w/attitude, intake, magnaflow turbo back, trans go jr. shift kit
2007 Genuine Rattler 110, when you dont feel like shifting.
Moderate weight loss, no bumper support in the back, back seat delete, BMR Kmember, A/C Delete, ABS Delete, Emmissions Delete, Catback Delete
-Most importantly, the car is lowered almost 2".
-Strange S/A Front Shocks w/ 275# spring. Usually set on click 3 or 4.
-Competition Engineering 3-way Rear Shocks. Usually set on 70/30 (firm compression, loose extension)
-Custom DIY rear anti-sway bar
-Spohn Tunnel Mount t/a (has custom adj front height settings). Pinion set at -1 (driveshaft method)
-Spohn Adj LCA's angle at -1.5 (front higher)
-Spohn LCA Relocation Brackets (bottom hole)
-Adj PHR
-Prostars, 15x8" 26/10.50/15 ET Street (12psi), Skinnies up front
-9" Rear w/ 3.89 / Detroit Locker
-Custom DIY SFC's
-6 Point Weld-in Rollbar
I think that's about it. Anything else in question, just ask. I've tried just about everything with the suspension adjustments, although they were tried before the new drag bar.
Moderate weight loss, no bumper support in the back, back seat delete, BMR Kmember, A/C Delete, ABS Delete, Emmissions Delete, Catback Delete
-Most importantly, the car is lowered almost 2".
-Strange S/A Front Shocks w/ 275# spring. Usually set on click 3 or 4.
-Competition Engineering 3-way Rear Shocks. Usually set on 70/30 (firm compression, loose extension)
-Custom DIY rear anti-sway bar
-Spohn Tunnel Mount t/a (has custom adj front height settings). Pinion set at -1 (driveshaft method)
-Spohn Adj LCA's angle at -1.5 (front higher)
-Spohn LCA Relocation Brackets (bottom hole)
-Adj PHR
-Prostars, 15x8" 26/10.50/15 ET Street (12psi), Skinnies up front
-9" Rear w/ 3.89 / Detroit Locker
-Custom DIY SFC's
-6 Point Weld-in Rollbar
I think that's about it. Anything else in question, just ask. I've tried just about everything with the suspension adjustments, although they were tried before the new drag bar.
Mike
You definitely need more LCA relocation holes. That's the sole reason I made 4 hole brackets for my car. No one had enough holes for adjustment. The new Moser and MWC both come with 4 hole relocation brackets for this reason. Drop that TA all the way down and cut those Spohn brackets off in favor of 3 hole lower than stock plus the stock hole. This will get the bite you are after.
__________________ 1999 Z28 M6, C5R timing chain, K&N Filter, Spiffy Black Seats, 1OTL, BPU+++
2006 Duramax 3500 DRW Crew
Edge juice w/attitude, intake, magnaflow turbo back, trans go jr. shift kit
2007 Genuine Rattler 110, when you dont feel like shifting.
You definitely need more LCA relocation holes. That's the sole reason I made 4 hole brackets for my car. No one had enough holes for adjustment. The new Moser and MWC both come with 4 hole relocation brackets for this reason. Drop that TA all the way down and cut those Spohn brackets off in favor of 3 hole lower than stock plus the stock hole. This will get the bite you are after.
So you're saying that I need to drop down the lca on the housing to give me more like a -2 or -2.5 degree angle on the control arm. This will get the tire to plant and more importantly, stay planted?
I've thought about designing a spacer that would replace the stock spacers for the heim joint on the control arm. The new spacer would have an eccentric offset hole. This way you could fine tune the angle of the lca. The only drawback would be that the lca would need to be adjustable in length to compensate for the rotating eccentric spacer. If I had AutoCAD available, I could draft something up in about 20 minutes.
So you're saying that I need to drop down the lca on the housing to give me more like a -2 or -2.5 degree angle on the control arm. This will get the tire to plant and more importantly, stay planted?
I've thought about designing a spacer that would replace the stock spacers for the heim joint on the control arm. The new spacer would have an eccentric offset hole. This way you could fine tune the angle of the lca. The only drawback would be that the lca would need to be adjustable in length to compensate for the rotating eccentric spacer. If I had AutoCAD available, I could draft something up in about 20 minutes.
Mike
Yes. Most relocation brackets out if not all of them all were designed with bringing the control back to stock parallel-ness if using 1.5" drop springs. I wanted more bite so I made 3 hole brackets instead of 2 lower than stock. This got me the bite I was after. An adjustable LCA with heim joints is highly recommend. Make sure you keep wheel base and the wheel centered.
__________________ 1999 Z28 M6, C5R timing chain, K&N Filter, Spiffy Black Seats, 1OTL, BPU+++
2006 Duramax 3500 DRW Crew
Edge juice w/attitude, intake, magnaflow turbo back, trans go jr. shift kit
2007 Genuine Rattler 110, when you dont feel like shifting.
An adjustable LCA with heim joints is highly recommend. Make sure you keep wheel base and the wheel centered.
What you're saying does make sense. I already have adj lca's, but they only have one heim joint, and the other end is a poly end. I was more or less just saying that in order for that eccentric spacer to work, the lca would have to be adjustable in length, and a fixed length lca would not work. I might just fab up a quick bracket this week, and if by some freak of nature we have good weather this weekend, try it out.
Yes. Most relocation brackets out if not all of them all were designed with bringing the control back to stock parallel-ness if using 1.5" drop springs. I wanted more bite so I made 3 hole brackets instead of 2 lower than stock. This got me the bite I was after. An adjustable LCA with heim joints is highly recommend. Make sure you keep wheel base and the wheel centered.
So here's a question for you. How would a person know if they have too much angle on the LCA? Also curious what distance from the existing hole I should make the new hole on the rearend bracket. A 1/2", 3/4" or more? Or should I pay more attention to the actual angle of the control arm itself?
Quote:
Originally Posted by xfactor_pitbulls
With your brackets you just made the car do what it does in your videos in the other post. You need to bring your IC intersecting point down and back. I aim for the drivers elbow for that imaginary IC point to start my initial setting. This will kill some of that squat and unloading you are experiencing in the videos and help provide faster forward motion. The rear shocks need to be on 50/50 setting as well.
This is your quote from that other thread about IC. How are you calculating the IC point? There seems to be alot of debate about this subject. About the shock settings, my theory for the 70/30 setting was that I want the tires to load quickly (loose extension), and then have a stiff rebound to keep them loaded. But I guess on a 50/50 setting you're trying to slow down the initial hit so that it doesn't have to work as hard to maintain the suspension loading? I'm just trying to understand the logic behind everything so that I can make educated changes in the future.
FWIW - Mike, moving the lowers to the stock hole fixed all my traction problems. I don't get the bounce and unload any more - just a solid dead hook with the tires @ 14psi.
__________________ -Jeremy
03 GMC Sierra RCSB 4x4 5.3
CAI - GMPP Exhaust.Exhaust Clip
So here's a question for you. How would a person know if they have too much angle on the LCA? Also curious what distance from the existing hole I should make the new hole on the rearend bracket. A 1/2", 3/4" or more? Or should I pay more attention to the actual angle of the control arm itself?
This is your quote from that other thread about IC. How are you calculating the IC point? There seems to be alot of debate about this subject. About the shock settings, my theory for the 70/30 setting was that I want the tires to load quickly (loose extension), and then have a stiff rebound to keep them loaded. But I guess on a 50/50 setting you're trying to slow down the initial hit so that it doesn't have to work as hard to maintain the suspension loading? I'm just trying to understand the logic behind everything so that I can make educated changes in the future.
Mike
Calculating....By Keeping it simple stupid. The kiss method works everytime. Instant center is the intersection of where the two planes meet. Its that simple. I use laser beams actually. A line through the center of the torque arm. And a line following the plane the control arm rides on. I made my brackets with holes equal distance. I basically just added another hole by making side plates using the spacing that was already there and it got me my -2 LCA angle I was after.
__________________ 1999 Z28 M6, C5R timing chain, K&N Filter, Spiffy Black Seats, 1OTL, BPU+++
2006 Duramax 3500 DRW Crew
Edge juice w/attitude, intake, magnaflow turbo back, trans go jr. shift kit
2007 Genuine Rattler 110, when you dont feel like shifting.
Instant center is the intersection of where the two planes meet. Its that simple. I use laser beams actually. A line through the center of the torque arm. And a line following the plane the control arm rides on.
That's how some people calc the IC. Others say that the IC is calc'd just by the LCA from wherever that plane hits the front of the t/a as if you dropped a plumb-bob from it. I'm not sure what to believe anymore lol... So do you adjust your LCA angle with someone sitting in the car loading the suspension, or empty?
I started making some adjustable plates for the LCA's today. I should have them finished up tomorrow if everything goes smooth.
I agree with adjusting the shocks back to 50/50 but I'm thinking they may also be shot. I've seen plenty of cases where those shocks don't last very long and with the limited adjustability it's probably time for an upgrade. You have nice shocks in the front so compliment them with a good set in the rear with more adjustability to dial this in. It just seems imo that there's way too much movement in the rearend before any other part of the car to just say that the suspension parts are just in the wrong spots. Your suspension may (and probably does) need tweaking but if you're fighting bad parts then you're just trying to mask the real issue.
__________________ Kaltech Tuning and Performance http://www.kaltechtuning.com/
17 North Belle Mead Rd.
Setauket, NY 11733
V. 631 242-6444
F. 631 242-6445
Proud to sponsor LS1 Melissa and her record setting pass.
I agree with adjusting the shocks back to 50/50 but I'm thinking they may also be shot. I've seen plenty of cases where those shocks don't last very long and with the limited adjustability it's probably time for an upgrade. You have nice shocks in the front so compliment them with a good set in the rear with more adjustability to dial this in. It just seems imo that there's way too much movement in the rearend before any other part of the car to just say that the suspension parts are just in the wrong spots. Your suspension may (and probably does) need tweaking but if you're fighting bad parts then you're just trying to mask the real issue.
The CE shocks aren't very old (35 passes?) and I don't think they're worn out. I just recently adjusted them to the 70/30 setting, and you could tell they were much, much stiffer on the compression. You can def tell the difference in the 3 different shock settings by running the shock through it's motion of travel. That being said, I understand what you're saying about the parts mis-match. If I could afford the Strange, QA1 or AFCO shocks for the rear, I'd be all over it. Knowing what I do now, I'd probably get a double adjustable shock for the rear, especially being a 6sp car.
I have a pretty good feeling that adjusting the LCA to give it more angle is going to work things out with the suspension. It's the only thing that I have changed and saw an immediate HUGE difference in traction. I had the LCA in the middle hole to try it out, made 3 passes and the 60's were in the 1.9x's. Dropped the LCA's back down to the bottom hole (at the time), and clicked off a 1.70 on the next pass. To me, the next logical step would be to try a lower hole, but at the time I was already on the very bottom hole. These 6sp cars don't seem to like the same suspension settings that the auto's do. I've found this out the hard way. Couple that with the fact that the car is lowered quite a bit, and it's been a rough road getting to where it's at now lol....
Machine 
