Phill your correct on this. The reason behind it is that the alky is so much more volatile to the air temps. Using a intercooler keeps the air temps pretty constant. The alky makes tons of power, but is very finicky. The Q-16 is some great stuff. Makes damn near the power the ALKY does if not more, only nice thing about the alky is that it saves a bunch of wait, but now that the addition of the intercoolers, how much weight are you really saving?!
-Rob
What he said about the intercoolers in the alky stuff. In the heat of the summer the air temps are through the roof so the tune for nite time is way different than the tune for during the heat of the day. The intercoolers are there to get the IAT's to be more consistant.
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All I am saying is that q16 makes more power than c16. The original topic was what fuel are you guys running, and we run q16. We also picked up mph and et at the track only changing the fuel.
Understood. I said above that I have heard good things about Q16.
Location: In the garage, working towards a 2900 lb raceweight :D
Posts: 10,779
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ponyhntr
I think you're under-estimating the power of an F2!
The thought was a detuned setting for the 9.5 index, and a pulley change and tune adjustment to get the car a little quicker
Guys have brought an intresteing point up about the volatility of the alky and the tune for tempature.
If it's THAT much different, even with the EFI maybe it's not worth it, thought was the strait pipe from the blower to the TB would make for a ton less weight and alot less complexity, but if the alcohol is gonna be that much if a pita with weather changes, maybe it's not worth it.
The alky should be less likely to be tune sensitive to weather than gas, but it has some other problems. If you want to run 9.50 with a F2 it will be very easy, you could run a simple/light air to air and go much faster than 9.50 and be safe.
Kurt
__________________ "I spend most of my money on cars and fuel, the rest I waste"
-First Gen3 in the 6's@ over 200
August 15th 2005 6.8660@205.47
-Hot Rod Drag Week 2006 small block power adder winner with 402 LS2 supercharged.
-My memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
Also, my memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
Location: In the garage, working towards a 2900 lb raceweight :D
Posts: 10,779
To be competitive in that class ya really need to be able to go a tenth under teh index, and know that on a good run if the other guy is ahead if you you are 100% sure he's breaking out.
I figured taht an F2 setup on alky would be able to run the # with ease and very little maintenance between rounds, then when I go to a race that there's no cap it's run what ya brung I can light the wick and probably dip the car into the 8's again, without throwing the sink at it.
KP's got his car into the 8's with an f1 and a 402, an F2 and a similar type motor on alky should be able to run where he's at with little effort.
What other problems does the alcohol have, other then the 3 gallon fuel cell's gonna have to get filled up after every run?
I use C16 this past weekend and MAN what a friggin difference over the Tractech 110 that I was using......
The car was absolutely an animal on a few units.... Couldn't keep it off the bumper.... ran 6.055 in the 1/8th mile lifting in 1st to avoid going on the bumper.....
I couldnt' believe the difference in fuel. I will never go back.... The Q16 however has me curious....
It will lean out your A/F ratios a full point? Question I have is do widebands (A LA FAST XFI and BS3) still read a correct A/F ratio on it???? We run my system in closed loop when on the unit..... Will it read the correct A/F ratio thru the wideband????
this info is awesome to me cause i've been loving the C16 and if Q is better than i'll go ahead and try that....
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KP went 8's with a 347 and the blower I believe was the F1C, he has a 364 now but has been struggling a bit now that he is trying to run it hard. One of his problems is a 8 rib serpentine belt slipping a bit.
In 2004 I went 8.50's with a F1R at 37XX pounds with a cog drive. The engine was 387ci and had the best parts available back then. The F2 should be very cool, and have enough balls to run 7's in a decent car.
Alky has a few problems with turning to gel if it sits in the car to long, causing the engine oil to fill with water and needing twice as much fuel volume as you would on gas. With a F2 on alky you would need multiple high volume electric fuel pumps or a mechanical front drive (my favorite) with 16 injectors in the intake or the newer high dollar specialty injectors. At the ET you want, you might look into a big air to air running on gasoline. It will do what you need with less weight and no filling ice between rounds!
Kurt
Quote:
Originally Posted by JL ws-6
To be competitive in that class ya really need to be able to go a tenth under teh index, and know that on a good run if the other guy is ahead if you you are 100% sure he's breaking out.
I figured taht an F2 setup on alky would be able to run the # with ease and very little maintenance between rounds, then when I go to a race that there's no cap it's run what ya brung I can light the wick and probably dip the car into the 8's again, without throwing the sink at it.
KP's got his car into the 8's with an f1 and a 402, an F2 and a similar type motor on alky should be able to run where he's at with little effort.
What other problems does the alcohol have, other then the 3 gallon fuel cell's gonna have to get filled up after every run?
__________________ "I spend most of my money on cars and fuel, the rest I waste"
-First Gen3 in the 6's@ over 200
August 15th 2005 6.8660@205.47
-Hot Rod Drag Week 2006 small block power adder winner with 402 LS2 supercharged.
-My memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
Also, my memory's not as sharp as it used to be.
Location: In the garage, working towards a 2900 lb raceweight :D
Posts: 10,779
Kurt thank you for the input, it's always valued and appreciated.
Sounds like sticking with the C16 would be a better route to take, the FMIC, not sure how big it will need to be, if I went with the new reverse procharger bracket that Jakes is coming out with, I'm sure I can get one in the car, but I will alreada be cutting the radiator supports out and fabbing up a new one to mount the radiator, and just use one of those smaller meziere radiators that have the pump mounted right on the radiator, that will take care of the pump being in the way for that cog drive system. I'll just have to make sure the FMIC fits in there too, a thick one with 4 inch inlet and outlet should work I think if I go that route.
I'm on a 402 now, and am considering just putting a set of dished pistons in it and a cam swap, the ET 240 heads would most likly work fine as long as I can get the compression where I need it. Could always get a different set of rods too if need be, 6.1's as long as the rings won't be too close to the bottom of the sleeves it should be o.k.
I wanted to go with an F2 becuase I should be able to pulley it to run around the 9.4 # with a relativly low boost setting, then have a 2nd pulley set to change to when I want to light the fire for the races there's no limits on.
I do think with enough power the car should be capable of running 8.5x so if I wanted to, I could run that class as well, which opens up alot more places/times to race the car.
Just have to look into building a bulkhead and putting the fuel cell in the ttop area next to the battery rather then in the nose, so that way there's no concerns with space under the hood.
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