Well the time has come for me to purchase a fast intake and I really dont know what to get
Used Fast 90mm (ported preferably)
New non-ported Fast 92mm
New ported Fast 92mm
Is it worth it to get a Fast 92mm?
Are the gains in a non ported Fast 92mm significant over a ported 90mm
Going with a ported LS2 TB no matter what intake I end up getting.
Motor is a 6.0L iron block 415ci 244/248 .612/.615 112.
All Pro Heads (ported)
Flow great mid range and 354cfm @.6
Looking for quality info, thanks guys
__________________ Teh ol' 383 < Click me
Best 1/4 mile time 13.01@121
***Soon to be 415ci***
On your setup you should see significant gains ported or not but of course ported would be better.
__________________
Quote:
Originally Posted by 505GOAT
Gorgeous car, Gorgeous hood, Motor blessed by God himself, The best wheels ever created, and tuned by Allan Futral the LS whisperer.....I can't help but vote for Detoxx it's like the next best thing to voting for myself.....lol
the only porting that gets done is smoothing out the runners, correct? if that's all them just about anyone that has a little knowledge and the right tools should be able to get it done pretty well right?
__________________ Reggie
2001 trans am
lid, long tubes, hurst pro 5.0, some suspension...
the only porting that gets done is smoothing out the runners, correct? if that's all them just about anyone that has a little knowledge and the right tools should be able to get it done pretty well right?
I just got done porting my FAST 90 and it is very simple. Just take your time. Once you get your intake and pull it apart you will know what has to be done to it. You basically smooth the intake runners on the top shell, open up the mouth of the intake, and on the bottom there are a few raised up places you can sand down where the mold looks like it came together or something. Also hit the intake with some sandpaper where the intake runners meet the heads. There is a lip on the inside you can knock off there. Almost all the porting is done on the top shell. If you need any help when you get ready to port it, pm me and I will be glad to help.
the only porting that gets done is smoothing out the runners, correct? if that's all them just about anyone that has a little knowledge and the right tools should be able to get it done pretty well right?
Wrong they also open up the mouth. Most vendors that do the porting sell the combo which includes the TB thats has been opened up.
Porting of the mouth is only done when a bigger than 92mm TB is put on the manifold. The more you know.
Well, atleast on the 90mm version there is a lip in the mouth that you can smooth down and smooth out and sand down all the way to the first runner "kinda hard to explain without pics".
Porting of the mouth is only done when a bigger than 92mm TB is put on the manifold. The more you know.
Like no one has ever misspelled a word before sorry I offended you.
How is porting of the mouth only done when there is a bigger TB. For instance Vengeance sells their intake as 96 mm with or without TB. If you want you could still put a 92 mm TB on the intake.
Like I said before there is more in the mouth that can be done to make it better besides opening it up. He said he is useing a ported ls2 tb so he would'nt have to have it opened much anyways.To answer the OP question, I would buy a used FAST 90 and do the porting yourself. You can open up the mouth of it to whatever would match the ported tb you are going to use. It would be the most cost effective route.
No offense but there is "porting" a FAST and then there is porting a FAST.
It all sounds the same doesn't it.....your buddy says "Hey....I have a ported FAST" (then the next guy) "Hey....I have a ported FAST also". Problem is in most cases the work performed wont look (or work) the same. In fact I have seen some "ported FAST's" make 5-10 RWHP less than a stocker unported. Dont think Im BS'ing cause Im not.
I have about half a coffee can full of plastic chips using a carbide cutter when I port one of these intakes. Not to mention many hours invested in spite of the fact I have done it so much I feel I might be able to do it in my sleep now having perfected the process five years and a couple of hundred intakes later.
Im not so much trying to sell my work here (which admittedly is on the pricier side) as much as I am trying to sober some of you up recommending a novice go in and "sand some things smooth" thinking they really accomplished anything. I see all these pics of sandrolled runners and parts of the intake fussed with that has ZERO impact on airflow (as checked and verified on my flowbench years ago) and I shake my head....most of it isn't even addressing the shortcomings in the shape of the manifold. You need real plastic removal in the right places to truly increase the airflow and you need to leave material in other key places which I often see removed.
Some of what I see sold these days is more fluff work than anything else but how would you know unless you had seen a properly modified intake to compare it to? Answer is you wont know, and some shops count on it, while you bolt it on hoping the money you spent was worth something.
Is it any different than "ported heads".....think there is a difference between a premium CNC ported aftermarket casting and most ported OEM castings. At this point I think the answer to that most of the sharper among you know.....there is nothing different about a ported intake as well so trust who you enlist to do the work before you hand them over your $800 hunk of plastic.
OK....Im off my soapbox for now (off, coincidentally, to finish a customer's FAST I am working on....LOL). We now bring you back to the "matrix" (aka the Internet), where all ported FAST intakes are equal regardless of price and who handles the work.....even a novice at home can achieve similar results.
(But in the REAL WORLD.....you always get what you pay for. The wiser and likely older you get the more you will come to appreciate that simple life lesson).
Regards,
Tony
__________________ Tony "Morpheus" Mamo invites you to take the Blue Pill...welcome to the "real world"
Last edited by Tony Mamo @ AFR; 10-04-2009 at 07:15 PM..
No offense but there is "porting" a FAST and then there is porting a FAST.
It all sounds the same doesn't it.....your buddy says "Hey....I have a ported FAST" (then the next guy) "Hey....I have a ported FAST also". Problem is in most cases the work performed wont look (or work) the same. In fact I have seen some "ported FAST's" make 5-10 RWHP less than a stocker unported. Dont think Im BS'ing cause Im not.
I have about half a coffee can full of plastic chips using a carbide cutter when I port one of these intakes. Not to mention many hours invested in spite of the fact I have done it so much I feel I might be able to do it in my sleep now having perfected the process five years and a couple of hundred intakes later.
Im not so much trying to sell my work here (which admittedly is on the pricier side) as much as I am trying to sober some of you up recommending a novice go in and "sand some things smooth" thinking they really accomplished anything. I see all these pics of sandrolled runners and parts of the intake fussed with that has ZERO impact on airflow (as checked and verified on my flowbench years ago) and I shake my head....most of it isn't even addressing the shortcomings in the shape of the manifold. You need real plastic removal in the right places to truly increase the airflow and you need to leave material in other key places which I often see removed.
Some of what I see sold these days is more fluff work than anything else but how would you know unless you had seen a properly modified intake to compare it to? Answer is you wont know, and some shops count on it, while you bolt it on hoping the money you spent was worth something.
Is it any different than "ported heads".....think there is a difference between a premium CNC ported aftermarket casting and most ported OEM castings. At this point I think the answer to that most of the sharper among you know.....there is nothing different about a ported intake as well so trust who you enlist to do the work before you hand them over your $800 hunk of plastic.
OK....Im off my soapbox for now (off, coincidentally, to finish a customer's FAST I am working on....LOL). We now bring you back to the "matrix" (aka the Internet), where all ported FAST intakes are equal regardless of price and who handles the work.....even a novice at home can achieve similar results.
(But in the REAL WORLD.....you always get what you pay for. The wiser and likely older you get the more you will come to appreciate that simple life lesson).
Regards,
Tony
How much do you charge to port a FAST? Just curious. The only reason I did my own is because I am completly BROKE! If I was'nt I would have came to you because you seem to be highly respected in the porting field. Don't get me wrong, I believe your ported FAST is FAR better than my self-ported FAST. I just assumed the OP was on a budget (as I am) and figured me telling him what I did on my port job could help him pick up a few HP over the one coming straight from the factory. All I told him to do is basically smooth out the intake runners on the top shell where all the casting marks are and smooth all the sides of the top shell runners and all the rough edges where the intake meets the heads and such. I know it won't pick up near the power as one of your units would but i doubt he would lose power from what I have done. Please correct me if I am wrong.
How much do you charge to port a FAST? Just curious. The only reason I did my own is because I am completly BROKE! If I was'nt I would have came to you because you seem to be highly respected in the porting field. Don't get me wrong, I believe your ported FAST is FAR better than my self-ported FAST. I just assumed the OP was on a budget (as I am) and figured me telling him what I did on my port job could help him pick up a few HP over the one coming straight from the factory. All I told him to do is basically smooth out the intake runners on the top shell where all the casting marks are and smooth all the sides of the top shell runners and all the rough edges where the intake meets the heads and such. I know it won't pick up near the power as one of your units would but i doubt he would lose power from what I have done. Please correct me if I am wrong.
I wasn't trying to single you out with my response....it was more generic in nature and somewhat relieving pressure of countless times looking the other way at some of the recent (and older) FAST threads concerning porting etc.
Sorry if it looked like I was coming down on you personally. In short, I don't think what you did probably hurt anything, but I question whether it actually helped anything either. Would have to really see it and ultimately flow a head with it attached to really quantify the value of the work you performed (I test intakes by seeing how they effect the net airflow to the head....flowing an intake by itself is also a meaningless exercise some people/shops refer to). An intake manifold represents an extension of the intake port.....shape it right and it picks up.....shape it wrong and it hurts it, no different than shaping the actual intake port in such a way it hurts (or helps) airflow.
For a better understanding, flow an intake port with a radius plate attached (best case scenario).....then flow it thru an LS1 intake.....watch close to 50 CFM's vanish from the peak. Flow it with a stock LS6....watch 42-44 CFM's vanish. Then a FAST unported.....drops the loss to 35 or so. A properly ported unit can see that number drop another 10-12 CFM's or so. The intake port hasn't changed or even moved off the flowbench but swapping intakes has led the engine (flowbench in this case) to believe it just got that much better an intake port bolted on it and will respond accordingly by processing more of that air into energy and power at your rear wheels with the proper addition of fuel to compensate for it. No different than bolting on a higher flowing set of heads really....at least as far as just the intake port is concerned.
Hope this helps....
-Tony
PS....$550 is what I charge to port a new FAST. Its pretty much been that price for the last three years or so. Some of the stuff I see now is priced so low now you have to ask yourself what could they actually be doing for the money charged Were they just charging you more and doing the same a year ago or are they doing even less work now?? Porting is all about time, craftsmanship, and experience and you usually pay for all three.
__________________ Tony "Morpheus" Mamo invites you to take the Blue Pill...welcome to the "real world"
Thanks for the post Tony. I took no offense to it. Im sure what little I did did'nt do much but it makes me feel acomplished . I just did'nt want to do "too much" because lets face it, I did'nt fully know what I was doing. I wish I could have done a back to back dyno test to see the real gains but for the $200 it was going to cost, I decided otherwise.
I can vouch for Tony Mamo's porting. I have done numerous back to back dyno comparisons between a stock FAST and a Mamofied FAST. The difference is always a solid 10+rwhp better.
In regards to the 90 vs 92 FAST, it may come as a surprise that the choke in the system is not the mouth of the TB opening, but the runners of the intake. Here, a ported FAST 90 makes more power than a non ported FAST 92. Before revision J, the older FAST 90s flowed better than the REV J 90s and later FAST 92s (which also had the Rev J changes).
If you can find a pre-REV J FAST 90, they will make the most power when ported by Tony Mamo. I've seen gains of 30+rwhp over an LS6 intake.
__________________ 2009 Pontiac G8 GT Vararam, EFI Live tuned, Cruising in 4 cylinder mode, hauling on 8. 2000 Pewter Ram Air Trans Am M6 heads/cam 508 rwhp/445 rwtq SAEMods list, Idle Sound Clip, WOT video, 183.092mph video 2008 GMC Yukon Denali XL 6.2L K&N FIPK, variable valve timing tuned to the max w/EFI Live. 2007 Jeep Grand Cherokee SRT8 sold: 12.12@112.70mph, 150.942mph Texas Mile. LS1,LS2,LS3,LS7 Custom Camshaft Specialist For custom camshaft help press here. Custom LSX drivability & dyno tuning by appointment only.
I can vouch for Tony Mamo's porting. I have done numerous back to back dyno comparisons between a stock FAST and a Mamofied FAST. The difference is always a solid 10+rwhp better.
In regards to the 90 vs 92 FAST, it may come as a surprise that the choke in the system is not the mouth of the TB opening, but the runners of the intake. Here, a ported FAST 90 makes more power than a non ported FAST 92. Before revision J, the older FAST 90s flowed better than the REV J 90s and later FAST 92s (which also had the Rev J changes).
If you can find a pre-REV J FAST 90, they will make the most power when ported by Tony Mamo. I've seen gains of 30+rwhp over an LS6 intake.
Pat,
I have finally gotten a good handle on how to carefully work around Revision "J" (add a "unk"....LOL).
Still dont know what Comp/FAST was thinking with that deal but oh well. I now have those two runners flowing within a couple of CFM of the other six runners without the hump in the wall. Havent talked to you in awhile discussing that but I have a pretty good plan of attack now regarding how I grind and shape that area which seems to work pretty well. A couple of CFM net less to the cylinder (flowing the head with the intake attached) is likely not going to be seen....especially considering only two of the eight ports are effected. At this point I don't think one of my former 90mm ported units would work any better come dyno time now and the stainless fasteners and better O-ring design of the 92 is a nice perk getting into the later model unit.
Just an FYI
__________________ Tony "Morpheus" Mamo invites you to take the Blue Pill...welcome to the "real world"
Like no one has ever misspelled a word before sorry I offended you.
How is porting of the mouth only done when there is a bigger TB. For instance Vengeance sells their intake as 96 mm with or without TB. If you want you could still put a 92 mm TB on the intake.
What would be the point of porting the mouth to 96mm but using a throttle body that doesn't even have a mouth that size? Think about it man
Vengeace pairs those manifolds up with bigger mouth throttle bodies
__________________ 2007 Chevrolet Colorado Z85
2002 Chevrolet Camaro Z28
Need Help with Fast Intake Decision** 
. I just did'nt want to do "too much" because lets face it, I did'nt fully know what I was doing. I wish I could have done a back to back dyno test to see the real gains but for the $200 it was going to cost, I decided otherwise.
