I picked up a new daily driver and am retiring the Hawk to nites and weekends for nice weather.
I have 76K miles on it and am thinking more and more everyday of putting a nice cam in it and cat forward exhaust from SLP.
I keep coming back to the Texas speed Magic sticks, with alot of horses gained by the MS4, butI may want the tamer/more driver friendly MS3.
Anyone have the MS3 or know any LS1 owners with the MS3?
please post your thoughts and opinions.
thx
when you say cat foward, im assuming you mean headers? if so, there are MUCH better options than SLP. At that price range, look into QTP
as far as the cam, the driveabilty of a cam is in its tune. You will see a TON of guys on here with the MS3, its pretty popular and can be fairly driveable
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these questions have been answered a thousand times, esp lately. this is why the internal sections have become the laughing stock and so hated by everyone. and for you, i'd say ms3 based on your little info. or maybe you should look into torquer 3
Well...no dyno numbers yet because I just finished painting it, and they might be a little scewed, because I did head/cam/exhaust/ and intake all at once...also, I have texas speed true duals kit, so no y-pipe for me. The sound is amazing, but straight headers might be a little too much for the street. I am using a LS6 stage 1 head from tsp...
Im just thinking of headers and high flow cats for the e-tests that we have to pass every 2yrs and a lumpier cam for a performance increase but retain alot of driveability. Heads are not out of the question as long as I can return to stock if ever wanted in the many yrs to come.
As far as a cam only set up I would recommend the MS4. That cam will have the same top end pull as the MS3 and cams like it, but should also feature a good amount of low end power for a cam that size. We used comps new LSK lobes to bring in as much of that low end as possible. I have had many customers tell me that their MS4 has better driveability then their previous MS3 because of the added low end power. But remember A LOT of driveability is in your tune. The only downside to the MS4 is because of how aggressive it is, it can only be run with stock valves in the engine unless you flycut. Good luck with your choice and feel free to give us a call if you have any other questions!
I was once debating between the MS3 and MS4. Considering the deals TSP has with purchasing heads AND a cam, you really should consider doing a heads and cam package from them, as you will save a TON.
The different combo's I came to without flycutting the pistons was either the MS4 cam and the stage 1 LS6 heads, or the MS3 cam and the stage 2.5 5.3l heads. Both cost about the same, and yeilded about the same peak power as the 5.3l heads at stage 2.5 flowed better and made up for the power loss between the MS3 and the MS4. Given that both made the same power, and the MS3 was better for driveability, I chose the MS3 cam with the PRC stage 2.5 5.3l heads.
The MS3 cam is still a VERY aggressive cam. It still can be a pain to drive in town, and start on a cold day. But not as bad as the MS4 that you pretty much have to start and wait to reach regular running engine temps just before you can drive it. Both thump hard at idle, and make awesome power.
My heads and MS3 cam (that was cut on a 114 LSA) joined with an SLP air lid, FAST 92mm intake, PTE 92mm TB, SLP underdrive pulley, Walbro 255lph fuel pump, SVO 42# injectors, ARH 1 3/4 headers, ARH ORY, Magnaflow catback made 441 RWHP on a hot summer day on a dyno in the Appelation mountains in PA (getting it put on another dyno this weekend closer to sea level on a cooler day. I have seen some guys put down 465 RWHP+ with similar setups, with an average being about 450 at the wheels (with the heads, cam, and support mods like I have done).
Definately look to the MS4 over the MS3. It makes power earlier & makes a few more peak hp compared to the MS3 camshaft. The MS4 camshaft gained over 90fwhp over the stock camshaft!
Here's dyno sheets comparing the MS4, a competitors popular 240/244 & the stock camshaft. Notice how the MS4 makes peak power & torque earlier with less duration than the larger camshaft...
(QUOTE)
The MS3 cam is still a VERY aggressive cam. It still can be a pain to drive in town, and start on a cold day. But not as bad as the MS4 that you pretty much have to start and wait to reach regular running engine temps just before you can drive it. Both thump hard at idle, and make awesome power.
That my friend is pure bullshit at its finest!! My car isn't garage kept and its daily driven unless the weather won't permit it. Which means MT Drag Radials are a bitch in rainny weather and If there is ICE on the road forget it. Other than that my car cranks up and defrosts the ice off the windshield and we ride. If its just cold enough to cloud your windshield. I don't wait. I run the wipers to clear the windshield till the defrost is hot enough to do the job itself. And I never have to crank my car but once. I don't care if its 20 degrees outside or 100. A MS4 with the correct tuning is no problem as a daily driver.
Hey Jason will the ms4 work with dart 225 2.05 int 1.60 ext head from a p to v standpoint if the heads are box stock.
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NC98Z I disagree completely on your theories on driveability. While the 98 computer is much harder to get lined out, we have tons of people that drive them daily without any issues. The tune is absolutely critical, with a good tune you can definately drive the MS4 way before operating temps are reached.
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