The heads were basically cleaned up with minor port work and the intake manifold was untouched. It has a LSXR manifold and 102mm tb now and went 9.90's @135 with race weight at 3700#
Last edited by Kaptain Kirk; 10-24-2009 at 03:29 PM..
but in all fairness erl's.500ci motor did use stock ls7 heads... put those lsw allpro-heads from wcch. then youll have boogeyman motor...or put those 32valve heads on ther holy shit batman thers your 700rwhp
i dought it is rwhp... take that 730hp subtract 18percent driveline loss and you got what i got. with 427cubicinches no 500cubic inches besides that motor is like 20k.i did all my mods for $9500 installed
I am by no means trying to come off as being condescending towards your set up by asking that question. What I was trying to get at is, for the results the OP was looking for it's going to be spendy any way you hash it out.
That 500ci ERL would be simply AWESOME if it wasn't so damn expensive. Its just way too much money, if you plan to use the regular top end stuff (LS7 heads, LS7 intake, FAST intakes...etc..) all you're gonna get is an engine with just a little bit more than a run of the mill built 427ci-440ci.
There's a guy on here with one that makes only 650 RWHP, thats a joke for a 500ci engine. Its gonna be a very fast car, no doubt...but for 500ci.....lol
You can build a 454ci LSX for half the money or less....and make MORE than 650 RWHP with the right top end and not spend near $25,000.
Its 100%, all about the intake and heads. Cubes are meaningless if they can't breath.
"There's no replacement for displacement".....well displacement means nothing with the right top end.
.
__________________ 1998 WS6 T/A 492 RWHP//495 RWTQ (w/cats)
LS6 427ci LPE short block, Ported stock TB, Ported LS6 intake, Ported LS1 heads, cam: 244/244 .610/.610 114 lsa, 1 7/8" Grotyohan LT's, 3" custom "Y" back to a Magnaflow Muffler, Built tranny...by a friend, Strange 12 bolt, 3.73 gears, Baer brakes, Hotchkis STB, LG Motorsports: Panhard Rod, LCA's, SFC's, G2 Super Springs, Hals all around, 315/rear, 275/front
Life may not be the party we hoped for, but while we're here we might as well DANCE.
You don't know much if you say put a turbo on it. IT'S A 6 SPEED. It's way to hard to make a 6 speed work with boost.
Wasn't paying attention to the 6 speed, my bad. not that it cant be done tho.
and its not way hard to make a street friendly 700hp n/a smallblock??
__________________ 1999 NBM Z28 408ci, M6, MWC 9", 3.89's, 244/250 111+3 Custom hood and spoiler...Everything but good heads.. 13mpg 1964 Chevelle SS Vert, 572ci, 5sp, 9" locker w/ 3.89s. Truck arm suspension, Custom everything. 8mpg 1997 Kawasaki Vulcan 750 - 60mpg ------ 10/26/06 RIP John Seaton - Best friend and a great car guy
My vote is a 540cid BBC. You should be able to make 750-800fwhp on pump gas with no problem and have more torque and area under the curve than you know what to do with. I really believe it could be done with decent heads and a moderate camshaft. There are some guys over on speedtalk that have done bigger 598cid motors making 900+fwhp on pump gas with very nice heads and moderate to racy camshafts. If you are worried about weight, use a Dart aluminum block.
I really think you are going to have a hard time reaching such a "goal" on the LS platform. It is a great engine and it can be done, but the engine will be high maintenance and what we call around here "a short life-r".
You said you don't want this to become a thread about what is and what is not streetable, so put what ever engine you want in there that makes the power you are after and call it done. Let us know how it works out for you.
Here is a motor you can put in there which is at your power level and beyond... and here is a hint: I know this guy and I doubt he has ever looked at LS1Tech. Which means quit BS'ing with these dreams.
if you actually drive the car quite a bit then go hydraulic roller. Way less maintenance. Kiss your 8,000rpm redline good bye with one as well.
A Hydraulic roller should be good to around 7300-7500rpm with good valvetrain and lightweight valves. They are a hell of a lot cheaper than going solid roller too.
The power is in the heads.... get the best you can afford. A 4.1" stroker LS7 makes 440ci. That is a good bang for the buck. You can hit 600rwhp and have a car with no cam surge, can still run a/c without issues, and spin to 7K RPM+. Need more power... spray a 150hp shot. Resleeve the LS7 block if you plan to spray.
Beyond the 440/441/447ci size is where your wallet makes that whooshing sound with how fast the money flies out of it. A 454 large stroker motor is a stump puller and has a poor rod ratio for high revs....
My 421 made 630rwhp w/ a sheetmetal intake and I have 243 castings!
W/ a 454 and ETP 245s and a matched solid cam, 700rwhp is all in the details at that point. IE Dry sump, light weight valves, 15:1+ cr etc.
Just call up Allan Futral and tell him what you want, he'll get it done, no whining or crying. He tuned my car and I drive it on the street ANYTIME I can.
__________________ 1999 Formula WS6 421ci l Solid roller l 15:1cr
2005 Caddy EXT
The stupid part was trying to run 13:1 on pump GAS.
By that I mean 91-93 octane premium unleaded.
Can you run it on E-85? Hell yeah and it would love it.
The motor you described will not like the street at all. Can you do it? Yeah.
That FMS motor would not last long on the street. Hell it didn't last long in a race car. Don't worry about limiting stroke so the motor will RPM. You will be far more valvetrain and oiling sytem limited on your RPM than any crank that can be stuffed in a ls motor.
700 rwhp is a hell of a lot harder than 600 rwhp. And 600 rwhp in a streetable combo isn't at easy as some people think.
I wasn't trying to be an ass. I was just concerned about some kid reading the 13:1 on pump gas and then trying it with his motor and it blowing up. Somebody mentioned the term DCR on here in passing a few years ago and within 2 months people were running around here acting like it was a new spec you could order on a camshaft.
There are way too many people around here that think that just because you can do something, then that means you should do it.
Make sure you have your info correct. The car that motor is going in is still under construction.
Ideal CR on pump gas on a DD car is 11.1-11.3 MAX ! A serious weekend car with proper tuning car go 12.0 on pump gas,anything past that is just asking for it Just my opinion?
__________________ Allan Futral
NBM '99 Camaro SS 6-speed 9.95@136.80 1.33 60' 3250lbs 347 ci ! N/A 9.88@144.24 1.54 60'on 250 hp n2o 3500 lbs-old setup
My LS7/L92 is 13:1 and I run it on 110. I can drive it on pump but can't get into it hard (wouldn't do it on the street anyway). It's a hydraulic roller with the stock ported L76, it makes 536 rwhp with the th350 (would be well over 600 with an m6)
I will make more power when I get a decent intake/ tb on it, it still has an 85mm maf and 90 tb.
Car drives great and idles very well during street driving.
Make sure you have your info correct. The car that motor is going in is still under construction.
Ideal CR on pump gas on a DD car is 11.1-11.3 MAX ! A serious weekend car with proper tuning car go 12.0 on pump gas,anything past that is just asking for it Just my opinion?
My 418 is 12.0 to 1. I drove it on 2 Hot Rod Power Tours. Both long hauls. That's 2500 miles each. It was driven during the week and weekends. I ran 28 degrees timing with NO KR. I raced the car on pump gas at 28 degrees timing every other week end. I am finishing up a 383 that is 11.9 to 1 as we speak. I am sure there are kids out there trying to tune there own stuff burning down motors. I am no kid. I am 40 years old and I tune my own car. I own my own shop and I build LSX's for a living. Most of the posts I am getting are key board warriors that know nothing but what they read. Thanks for the input but I asked for real world results. Futral is a awesome shop that has built some awesome cars. I don't understand why you would say 11.3 MAX. I do it all the time close to 12.1 with great results. I was looking for wisdom from the big boys but it looks like it can't be done. I give up! NOT
I am going to spend my $20,000 and get as close to my goal as possible. I will more than likely go 12.5 cr, sheet metal intake, and solid roller. I bet you it will make 650rw plus with race gas and a race gas tune up. Pipe dreams? lol
Now I remember why I don't post much on here. Thanks to everyone who gave there input.
Make sure you have your info correct. The car that motor is going in is still under construction.
Ideal CR on pump gas on a DD car is 11.1-11.3 MAX ! A serious weekend car with proper tuning car go 12.0 on pump gas,anything past that is just asking for it Just my opinion?
My apologies Alan. Never meant it as a dig to you or your motors. I thought the link was to another motor.
My point was that it sounded like he was wanting race motor power out of a pump gas motor and the two just don't go together. When you start getting into the power these motors are making, they just don't last for 50,000 miles on the street. They aren't meant to.
Once again, I thought the link was to another deal and I know that you have many, many big HP motors making power for a long time.
I completely agree with your statements on the compression issue.
My 418 is 12.0 to 1. I drove it on 2 Hot Rod Power Tours. Both long hauls. That's 2500 miles each. It was driven during the week and weekends. I ran 28 degrees timing with NO KR. I raced the car on pump gas at 28 degrees timing every other week end. I am finishing up a 383 that is 11.9 to 1 as we speak. I am sure there are kids out there trying to tune there own stuff burning down motors. I am no kid. I am 40 years old and I tune my own car. I own my own shop and I build LSX's for a living. Most of the posts I am getting are key board warriors that know nothing but what they read. Thanks for the input but I asked for real world results. Futral is a awesome shop that has built some awesome cars. I don't understand why you would say 11.3 MAX. I do it all the time close to 12.1 with great results. I was looking for wisdom from the big boys but it looks like it can't be done. I give up! NOT
I am going to spend my $20,000 and get as close to my goal as possible. I will more than likely go 12.5 cr, sheet metal intake, and solid roller. I bet you it will make 650rw plus with race gas and a race gas tune up. Pipe dreams? lol
Now I remember why I don't post much on here. Thanks to everyone who gave there input.
If it doesn't I would be dissapointed. That is a completely obtainable goal.
That 500ci ERL would be simply AWESOME if it wasn't so damn expensive. Its just way too much money, if you plan to use the regular top end stuff (LS7 heads, LS7 intake, FAST intakes...etc..) all you're gonna get is an engine with just a little bit more than a run of the mill built 427ci-440ci.
There's a guy on here with one that makes only 650 RWHP, thats a joke for a 500ci engine. Its gonna be a very fast car, no doubt...but for 500ci.....lol
You can build a 454ci LSX for half the money or less....and make MORE than 650 RWHP with the right top end and not spend near $25,000.
Its 100%, all about the intake and heads. Cubes are meaningless if they can't breath.
"There's no replacement for displacement".....well displacement means nothing with the right top end.
.
it's not really a joke considering that ERL motor is using BONE STOCK LS7 heads. And again he even posted the graph of his old 427 vs his ERL 500. Which one would you rather have? the one with more peak power per cube or the one with 90 more hp/tq everywhere under peak rpm?
Just my opinion?
