Advanced Engineering Tech - Aluminum Cylinder Walls?

Quick question:

Is it possible to have aluminum as the cylinder wall material in an engine.

I dont think it is possible, but a friend of mine swears his 03 cobra has aluminum cylinder walls.

Anyone know?

You can, but you need to have a special coating on the bore. It is a super hard coating, I believe one of them is called Nikasil. It is sprayed onto the aluminum and makes it able to hold up to combustion temps.
I am not sure on the cobra, maybe a ford person can help you there.

no aluminum cylinder walls on any production or aftermarket cobra blocks. I have only seen one engine it was a pro fwd neon engine from mopar very expensive and not for running more than 1 pass at a time. Some other uses might be out there but not sure what for because they are so rare.

Its been done before, as a matter if fact, the original ZL1 Corvettes and Camaros had sleeveless all aluminum 427's (THE ZL1). That block supposedly had a very high silicon content so that when it was honed, the rings actually rode on the silicon and not the aluminum. There were also some 4 cyl engines in the late 60's with the same techology.

Also, to answer your other question, I know of no late model Cobra to come with a non-sleeved aluminum block...

Shane

Aluminum bore blocks are still in production today, but last I checked there was part incompatability issues between GM and briggs&stratton:D

Rotary engines have what would be the equivalent of aluminum cylinder walls. the rotor housings are aluminum, but it is also coated with a hard surface material. They all call it chroming since it is shiny, but not sure what the actual material is.

-John

Didn't Chevrolet try this on one of the Vega engines?

most of the aluminum engine has a steel liner or an iron sleeve. i personally would stay away from an engine that has no liner or sleeve.

BMW uses Alusil lining and previously used Nikasil. As mentioned, this is a hardened coating that goes on the bare cylinders. This makes the blocks unable to be bored without recoating ($$$ and hard or impossible to find someone to do it) Also, the higher sulfur gas here in the US ate the Nikasil lining, which resulted in huge warranty claims for BMW on the M60 V8 engines. (The PO of my car got a new engine @ 50K miles).

Quick question:

Is it possible to have aluminum as the cylinder wall material in an engine.

I dont think it is possible, but a friend of mine swears his 03 cobra has aluminum cylinder walls.

Anyone know?the 03 cobra doesnt even come stock wit an aluminum block lol. only the sn95 and some 99s got the aluminum teksid block

^ finally a ford guy showed up.

Katech's 500CI motor has aluminum cylinder walls, they also use the hardened coating, i believe its nikasil

The Katech 500 was Nicasil to begin with. At the AETC conference, Fritz indicated they later sleeved it (back to iron).

yea, my dirtbike has an aluminum cylinder with a nikasil "liner" somewhat costly to have it bored and re-lined so i could only imagine the cost to have 8 bores done.

Lots of crotch rockets use Nikasil on the aluminum cylinder walls (I've worked with LOTS of those engines) and it works out quite well for them.

The cost and engineering involved in doing it yourself for your engine though...not worth it at all.

Quick question:

Is it possible to have aluminum as the cylinder wall material in an engine.

I dont think it is possible, but a friend of mine swears his 03 cobra has aluminum cylinder walls.

Anyone know?

03-04 Cobras all have cast iron blocks, the mach 1 is aluminum though

when the early jaguar xk8's came out (97) they had aluminum cylinders with nikasil coatings... most of those motors have since been replace under waranty as previously stated above with the beamer motors

There are quite a few cars in production that have all aluminum sleeves. With the technology today they have become pretty strong.

http://www.zr1netregistry.com/ZR1_specs.htm

The Subaru EJ series engines have aluminum cylinder walls, along with Honda H22 as well I think.

Oliver

^^^ i don't think so man, they have to have some sort of liner or coating. otherwise those cylinder bore's will wear pretty quick.

The H22 Honda and the 2ZZ Toyota four bangers, Subaru EJ257 race blocks among others, use a MMC or metal matrix composite cylinder wall coatings. It is pretty tough stuff and eats my inserts when I sleeve these blocks. The pistons have a coating to make them compatible with the cylinder walls. Any after market race piston can be used after I sleeve these blocks, plus the ductile iron sleeves are stronger.

The Vega and the 430 Can Am blocks were cast in Reynolds 390 aluminum alloy. Mercedes uses or used the same alloy in some of their production blocks. This alloy has a high silicon content. Bores are lapped after honing to leave the hard silicon particles on the surface. Pistons were iron coated in these engines to prevent scuffing. I used to sleeve a lot of Vega blocks back then because many scuffed cylinder walls due to variations in the silicon content of the mass produced blocks.

Steve



^^^ i don't think so man, they have to have some sort of liner or coating. otherwise those cylinder bore's will wear pretty quick.

Im glad someone finally bought up the Reynolds 390 blocks. Those things were incredible, especially the 494 Big Block.

BTW, Ferrari has been on Nikasil liners since the days of the 308. So what does that tell you.

Actually it is the 328 and later Ferrari engines that have aluminum wet liners. The 308 used ductile iron wet liners. I have a large bore ductile iron wet liner kit for the 308 328 Ferrari engines.

The aluminum liners save weight but they won't stay round nor hold the power that a ductile iron liner will.

Steve


Im glad someone finally bought up the Reynolds 390 blocks. Those things were incredible, especially the 494 Big Block.

BTW, Ferrari has been on Nikasil liners since the days of the 308. So what does that tell you.

The Vega and the 430 Can Am blocks were cast in Reynolds 390 aluminum alloy. Mercedes uses or used the same alloy in some of their production blocks. This alloy has a high silicon content. Bores are lapped after honing to leave the hdumdumdum silicon particles on the surface. Pistons were iron coated in these engines to prevent scuffing. I used to sleeve a lot of Vega blocks back then because many scuffed cylinder walls due to variations in the silicon content of the mass produced blocks.
Steve
The American name for the process was Reynolds 390 as Steve describes. It is also known in Europe (Germany) as Alusil. Most manufacturers in Europe that use aluminum blocks have gone from Nikasil (coating) to Alusil since it is cheaper. This link has a good description of the processes. http://www.lnengineering.com/whynickies.html

B&S engines use a non plated aluminum bore...

Plated cylinders are real common in power sports, and street bikes, there are a couple turbo snowmobiles that make 530 hp from 2 cylinder 1200 cc engines (thats 7.2 hp per cubic inch) The plating is bullet proof, much harder than rings pistons, or any thing else that rides in there. The only time wear or damage becomes an issue is if something else goes wrong and parts bounce around in a running engine.

http://www.mt-llc.com/

and

http://www.usnicom.com/

are 2 places that do it in the US, msrp is about $200 per hole to strip / bore/ re-plate/ and hone.. Far cheaper than the 400 to 800 per cylinder to replace with new on a bike or sled...

Actually it is the 328 and later Ferrari engines that have aluminum wet liners. The 308 used ductile iron wet liners. I have a large bore ductile iron wet liner kit for the 308 328 Ferrari engines.

The aluminum liners save weight but they won't stay round nor hold the power that a ductile iron liner will.

Steve

wet liner ? i think you mean wet sleeve. liner is just a very thin coating, and i do not see how you can run coolant around it without braking the bore.

Dunno if it was mentioned, C6R block is aluminum with no sleeves (saves weight/ affects handling), this engine isn't designed for longevity just to run a race.

Jaguar did have a production aluminum block, no sleeves, I don't think most made it to 100k miles

The Yamaha GP bikes (TZ's) had a chomium alloy cylinder coating and ran iron rings. Some tried recoating them with Nikasil with mixed success at the time.

Most of the Prototype cars in the ALMS and euro Le Mans series use all aluminium bores. They use a Nickel Silicon Carbide type coating (Nikasil?) on them which has a harder surface than iron does, which means less friction, and no heat expansion issues that are associated with iron liners. Even NASCAR engines, which are iron bore/iron block use Nickel coatings because of less friction on the rings and longer bore life.

Dunno if it was mentioned, C6R block is aluminum with no sleeves (saves weight/ affects handling), this engine isn't designed for longevity just to run a race.

Jaguar did have a production aluminum block, no sleeves, I don't think most made it to 100k miles

running 24 hours of high rpm is pretty damn good longevity.

the original GM aluminum engines had of problems because at first they didnt modify the water jackets to compensate for the different material.

I should be ovious that he has an iron block do does he think he has a iron block w/ aluminum walls:jest:

^^^^^^ ?:stupid:

porsche 968

I CANNOT BELIEVE THIS THREAD IS STILL RUNNING:bang: