Tools & Fabrication - Need help picking out a starter welder.

Hey guys thanks for the help in advance. Ive been thinking about getting a welder so i can make and weld on some sub frame connectors, exhaust stuff, and just general use on the car. I found a few from harbor freight and northern tools let me know what you guys think would be a good buy for me.

First the Northern Tool:
-115 volt, 70 amp for $80: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200355916_200355916

-230 volt, 200amp for $130: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200381950_200381950

Now the Harbor Freight:
-115 volt, 90 amp for $130: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=94056

-230 volt, 120 amp for $150: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=55833

I would love to go out and spend a lot on a good welder, but I cant yet cause I'm a college kid with a girlfriend, and a SS haha. Thanks guys!

Hey guys thanks for the help in advance. Ive been thinking about getting a welder so i can make and weld on some sub frame connectors, exhaust stuff, and just general use on the car. I found a few from harbor freight and northern tools let me know what you guys think would be a good buy for me.

First the Northern Tool:
-115 volt, 70 amp for $80: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200355916_200355916

-230 volt, 200amp for $130: http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/product_6970_200381950_200381950

Now the Harbor Freight:
-115 volt, 90 amp for $130: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=94056

-230 volt, 120 amp for $150: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/ctaf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=55833

I would love to go out and spend a lot on a good welder, but I cant yet cause I'm a college kid with a girlfriend, and a SS haha. Thanks guys!


First I wouldnt buy a cheap welder, honestly try ebay or craiglist for a name brand used one before that cheap crap.

Second you will really want a MIG welder, not an arc welder, or flux core machine. As a begginer, you will have alot of difficulty welding thin gauge stuff, imho.... I would look for a lincoln sp135 plus/ miller 140 up to an sp 175 or miller 180 hobarts are good also.

Just dont buy crap, you will regret it.

First I wouldnt buy a cheap welder, honestly try ebay or craiglist for a name brand used one before that cheap crap.

Second you will really want a MIG welder, not an arc welder, or flux core machine. As a begginer, you will have alot of difficulty welding thin gauge stuff, imho.... I would look for a lincoln sp135 plus/ miller 140 up to an sp 175 or miller 180 hobarts are good also.

Just dont buy crap, you will regret it.

Yea, +1, try to get a good quality (name brand) welder that will last. I'm partial to Lincoln and Miller but don't buy the cheap crap. You ALWAYS get what you pay for with tools!

-SS

You don't want no cheap AC welder. If you can not get a AC/DC welder then don't get anything. You dont want to weld your subframe or any part of you cage with MIG. MIG welds are not deep penetrating welds. I would stick rod weld my chassis with a DC welder over MIG any day of the week. Personally, I weld my cage and chassis stuff with TIG (heli-arc). Do not use a 6010 or 6011 rod on the cage or chassis either; use 7018.

Thanks for the fast replies guys! Looks like i won't be getting one yet then. I guess I'll have to wait till after college. What sucks is that i have damn near every other tool out there! Oh well thanks guys.

Your in Houston? I'm in Pasadena. I can help you out if you need something welded. Send me a PM if you want.

What About this one? found in on craigslist.
http://houston.craigslist.org/bar/1337930400.html

Your in Houston? I'm in Pasadena. I can help you out if you need something welded. Send me a PM if you want.

Thanks man, yeah i just want to learn how to weld and not have to go to a shop to get things welded. Kinda wanna make stuff like trailers and what not, just to try it out.

You don't want no cheap AC welder. If you can not get a AC/DC welder then don't get anything. You dont want to weld your subframe or any part of you cage with MIG. MIG welds are not deep penetrating welds. I would stick rod weld my chassis with a DC welder over MIG any day of the week. Personally, I weld my cage and chassis stuff with TIG (heli-arc). Do not use a 6010 or 6011 rod on the cage or chassis either; use 7018.

Dont weld on a chassis with a mig welder? You must have a plethora of welding knowledge....

If you cant get penetration with a properly set up mig welder, you dont know how to weld.

don't get the harbor freight welders, they are absolute junk.

I have this welder:

-230 volt, 120 amp for $150: http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=55833

I was just using it today in fact, to fix some old steel benches my wife doesn't want to throw out. Is it a great welder....no, but it gets the job done. I'm using flux core wire in it right now, but it does have the capability to run gas (which is nice...I guess). When I'm using gas I run straight CO2. If you're looking to build trailers and frames I would not use this machine. It's good for small repairs, exhaust and the like, but I wouldn't trust my life or anyone elses with it. If you're looking for something cheap to learn on it should be ok, but you will be buying another machine when you want to take on bigger projects.

Do you have a tractor supply near you? I'd look into the Hobart Handler 140. Awesome little welder to start with!

Keep an eye on craigslist.
In my area, I'm watching quality MIG and TIG 220V machines going for $300 to $1,500 depending on size/features etc...

You're also going to need accessories like Shielding gas, helmet, wire etc...

I bought a Clarke 130EN 110v MIG and it's as good as any other 110v BUT, I really wish I would have spent the extra money for a 220V machine.

my harbor freight welder worked well for like the first month, then is started sporadically feeding wire and got real jittery no matter how high you set the roller tension. Shortly after that, I had to "tweak" the rollers just to get enough tension to get the wire to feed at all. IMHO, for a less than 2 month old welder, that's my definition of junk.

Get a 220 unit.

just bought this off craigs list. guy paid 2300 i got it for 950. damn near brand new. Im a welder proffesionally and me and my co-workers were very suprised how well it welds. Plus itall run off co2 that i can buy at lowes and wallmart, 24/7/365 cept for x-mas LOL

http://houston.craigslist.org/tls/1321220196.html

ps im on gessner by I 10. you wanna come over and try mine say the word, ill show you how to weld real qwick so you know a little more what your lookin for. another of my co-workers has a Cracker Box if you wanna try Stick. I hate it but he loves it.......

e bay for hoods, wall mart for gloves, value village for a denim shirt.....what else you wanna know? I work with 23 other welders lol, MiG, TiG, Stick, Automated TiG, MiG Spray, yada yada yada

ps im on gessner by I 10. you wanna come over and try mine say the word, ill show you how to weld real qwick so you know a little more what your lookin for. another of my co-workers has a Cracker Box if you wanna try Stick. I hate it but he loves it.......

e bay for hoods, wall mart for gloves, value village for a denim shirt.....what else you wanna know? I work with 23 other welders lol, MiG, TiG, Stick, Automated TiG, MiG Spray, yada yada yada

Thanks for all the info man! I might have to take you up on that offer once my back get better! Yeah, welding is something I've just always thought would be an amazing craft to know.

I have a hazardous freight dual mig 151 welder. Overall, its an ok machine. I have probably put ~40-50 pounds of wire through it, and it does have its faults.

1. The torch head/umbilical cord sux. theres no better way to put that, cheaply made and no parts are available to service it. The outer rips and burns very easily and it has a plastic liner for the wire to slide through that wears easily and is not replaceable. It also has a tendency to leak shielding gas through the valve, so turn the bottle off when you stop welding. You can buy a new torch head/umbilical from HF for like $25 but its just the same cheap POS that is gonna break again.

Got pissed at mine last night, and went to mc master carr this morning:devil: Replace the stupid plastic wire liner with 5/32 nylon 6 tubing (its a direct bolt in) and you now have liner that you can buy in 100ft roles for $0.22 / ft:D. Replaced the worthless easy to rip and burn outer covering with 3/8" liquid tight PVC flexible conduit (think flexible electrical conduit but in PVC instead of steel) Put a liquid tight cord grip on to attach the pvc to the welder face and the umbilical is now 1000% better than it was.:pimp:

I`m not going to say its the best welder, but I have less than $200 in it including today`s mods and up until tonight it was pretty trouble free. (I nuked the DC rectifier diodes tonight welding up a boat trailer.:bang:) Guess I will see how much it is to replace those tomorrow. Overall I am still happy with my purchase, I would like a miller, or lincoln, but I have had this one for at least 4 years and the only problems so far were that the torch head/umbilical is very fragile, and now I nuked the stupid rectifier.

a co-worker, Tom, and his buddies bought a hobo freight TiG machine to weld a roll cage. they did what they needed, it worked well enough for em.

Then they decide they want more power.
they took apart the machine took out the 110v power cord wired in a 220v power cord and welded with it on maximum power for about 2 minutes.

It then started smoking and burst into flames haha. took Tom 10 min to tell me that cuz he couldnt stop laughing

AGH--your bums itchy!! 90 pecent of all auto welding is done with a mig. You must have a`cheap one. If done correctly it stands up to tests as well as or better than stick. I don't even think it's legal to weld a cage with a stick?


X's 2 on buying good equipment. Craigs list or free ads trader. 110v is "almost" useless. Get a decient 220v mig and you'll be happy for a long time.

Yep, I thought it was going to be something stupid like this.

New DC rectifier $ 10.00
Shipping didn`t even ask, wasn`t worried about it

Oh by the way we don`t stock that part and have to order from the mfg......10-12 week wait time:barf:.

Not having a welder for the next 3 months.....priceless:bang:
So just remember, if you buy a cheap welder it might suck to get parts

AGH--your bums itchy!! 90 pecent of all auto welding is done with a mig. You must have a`cheap one. If done correctly it stands up to tests as well as or better than stick. I don't even think it's legal to weld a cage with a stick?


X's 2 on buying good equipment. Craigs list or free ads trader. 110v is "almost" useless. Get a decient 220v mig and you'll be happy for a long time.

x2 on the first paragraph
x2 on good equipment
but a great big HUH? on 110v being useless. My miller is rated for 3/8 plate on 110v. if you know a few tips and tricks then a 110v machine will suite you just fine.

220 is always better but not always there, and 220v extension cords dollar wise cause heart attacks. a quality name brand machine works great on 110v but if you can get a machine that is switchable, mine is. I only have 110 but my co-worker ran a completely new 220v plug into his garage so if i need the power i go over there. I will note however that on 110v i can go to 7 out of 10 on my heat safely

x2 on the first paragraph
x2 on good equipment
but a great big HUH? on 110v being useless. My miller is rated for 3/8 plate on 110v. if you know a few tips and tricks then a 110v machine will suite you just fine.

220 is always better but not always there, and 220v extension cords dollar wise cause heart attacks. a quality name brand machine works great on 110v but if you can get a machine that is switchable, mine is. I only have 110 but my co-worker ran a completely new 220v plug into his garage so if i need the power i go over there. I will note however that on 110v i can go to 7 out of 10 on my heat safely

Not if you know where to look or make it yourself.

x2 on the first paragraph
x2 on good equipment
but a great big HUH? on 110v being useless. My miller is rated for 3/8 plate on 110v. if you know a few tips and tricks then a 110v machine will suite you just fine.

220 is always better but not always there, and 220v extension cords dollar wise cause heart attacks. a quality name brand machine works great on 110v but if you can get a machine that is switchable, mine is. I only have 110 but my co-worker ran a completely new 220v plug into his garage so if i need the power i go over there. I will note however that on 110v i can go to 7 out of 10 on my heat safely

You have a passport, right? there is no other machine like it, so its not a good comparison here. Thats like me matching my dynasty up to an econo tig, or my syncrowave 250 to a chinese mig tig plasma machine..... 110 welders have their niche, 3/8" plate isnt it.

PS your passport is rated for 140 amps output on 110, thats not enough for 3/8" On 220 it's rated for 3/8"

You don't want no cheap AC welder. If you can not get a AC/DC welder then don't get anything. You dont want to weld your subframe or any part of you cage with MIG. MIG welds are not deep penetrating welds. I would stick rod weld my chassis with a DC welder over MIG any day of the week. Personally, I weld my cage and chassis stuff with TIG (heli-arc). Do not use a 6010 or 6011 rod on the cage or chassis either; use 7018.

I agree do not buy a cheap welder you need a name brand MIG and you can hook a paint ball CO2 tank for the gas (it works good and is good if you don’t use the welder allot)

MIG welders can get the same strength weld as the arc welder it is all about the size of a welder.

It is a common misconception that small wire feed welders cant make strong welds or you cant weld a roll cage.. it is all about the thickness of the metal and most small wire feed welders have more than enough power for cages or anything you need them for.

If you happen to find a weld that requires a little more penetration you can grind a bevel in the pieces and leave a 1/8 inch gap, and if it is a deep weld you can make multiple passes.

x2 on the first paragraph
x2 on good equipment
but a great big HUH? on 110v being useless. My miller is rated for 3/8 plate on 110v. if you know a few tips and tricks then a 110v machine will suite you just fine.



Sorry, you are right. There are worthwhile 110 welders out there, the duel voltage units and the pricier 110 welders. When I think about the 110 units most people seem to talk about(harbor freight specials) it's been my experience they are useless. Just my .02.

You have a passport, right? there is no other machine like it, so its not a good comparison here. Thats like me matching my dynasty up to an econo tig, or my syncrowave 250 to a chinese mig tig plasma machine..... 110 welders have their niche, 3/8" plate isnt it.

PS your passport is rated for 140 amps output on 110, thats not enough for 3/8" On 220 it's rated for 3/8"

eh, yeah it is pretty badass lol. I do weld 3/8 on 110v, i bevel the edges and run several passes, slow and hot with the wire turned down.

I do see your point about the comparison though, although i also got a good deal on mine so i dont think its too big a stretch for the op to get a very good machine.

Either way IMHO a decent quality 110v MiG welder works great for most household and automotive jobs. As long as its got a shielding gas im not a big fan of Flux cored

eh, yeah it is pretty badass lol. I do weld 3/8 on 110v, i bevel the edges and run several passes, slow and hot with the wire turned down.

I do see your point about the comparison though, although i also got a good deal on mine so i dont think its too big a stretch for the op to get a very good machine.

Either way IMHO a decent quality 110v MiG welder works great for most household and automotive jobs. As long as its got a shielding gas im not a big fan of Flux cored

Beveling is a great way to use a 110 machine, or even just on thicker stuff on any machine, but you have to be carefull what/how you put stuff imo. I have seen people try to weldtrailer hitches with a 70 amp harbor freight fluxcore machine, and wonder why it doesnt stick together. I have a sign in my welding shop:

Labor rate: $95/hr
Portable $140/hr

If you help $200/hr

Most un-informed people are better just told to get the bigger machine, which either they will and hopefully learn how to use it, or bring it to someone who can...

PS. Dualshield is OK but standard fluxcore sucks IMHO.....

Beveling is a great way to use a 110 machine, or even just on thicker stuff on any machine, but you have to be carefull what/how you put stuff imo. I have seen people try to weldtrailer hitches with a 70 amp harbor freight fluxcore machine, and wonder why it doesnt stick together. I have a sign in my welding shop:

Labor rate: $95/hr
Portable $140/hr

If you help $200/hr

Most un-informed people are better just told to get the bigger machine, which either they will and hopefully learn how to use it, or bring it to someone who can...

PS. Dualshield is OK but standard fluxcore sucks IMHO.....

you and i are on the same book, page, paragraph, and line number.

thanks for the reminder about less knowledgeable welders, sometimes i forget not everybody does this 60 hours a week lol. hell sometimes I forget I do this 60 hrs/week haha, then i remember i do and my happy moment fades away

start out with a mig idk why you would want to weld the underside of a car with an arc welder that just confused the heck out of me readin that one, mig will do ya just fine and you will penetrate just the same as the arc with it and you really dont "need" a tig unless your welding aluminumunum

my subframes were welded on with mig and they work perfect any more penetration in the weld and my carpet would have caught fire lol

and get a 220v you will have so much more fun with that than a 110v

Sorry to hijack OP, but there seems to be a lot of great welders in here and I wanted to get some advice

What if my sole purpose of welding was to just weld exhaust (for turbo applications) and aluminum for intercoolers and piping and cage work.... NOTHING else. I like the process of TIG better, but I know the best machines are costly.

Until you said aluminum intercoolers I was going to say just get yourself a ford 3g alternator and a tig torch.

From everything I have read, you need high frequency AC to weld aluminum. At least if you want nice welds. And it seems like only the expensive TIG`s have that. But heres a thought, the original heli-arc tigs that people used to weld aluminum with were DC, I read that it was something about using helium to shield it that allowed you to weld aluminum with DC.

At any rate, I actually started building a 3g alt powered tig/arc welder last week. sorta patterned off this one http://myweb.cableone.net/rschell/TIG.htm I`m not really expecting a lot out of it, but I had most of the parts lying around the garage anyway so I figured I would give it a try. It has to be better than the old 225A AC buzzbox that I use for heavy welding right now.

Until you said aluminum intercoolers I was going to say just get yourself a ford 3g alternator and a tig torch.

From everything I have read, you need high frequency AC to weld aluminum. At least if you want nice welds. And it seems like only the expensive TIG`s have that. But heres a thought, the original heli-arc tigs that people used to weld aluminum with were DC, I read that it was something about using helium to shield it that allowed you to weld aluminum with DC.

At any rate, I actually started building a 3g alt powered tig/arc welder last week. sorta patterned off this one http://myweb.cableone.net/rschell/TIG.htm I`m not really expecting a lot out of it, but I had most of the parts lying around the garage anyway so I figured I would give it a try. It has to be better than the old 225A AC buzzbox that I use for heavy welding right now.

I had an alternator tig for a while, it worked well but in the end, if you weld a decent amount, it's worth it to step up to a real welder.

This past weekend I picked up a like new condition Lincoln Mig Pak 15 (220v) for $100.00 off an older guy that had no more use for it.
Look around cause deals are out there.