Automotive News, Media & Press - Might look for a daily driver/4 door???

I might need to get a car that is client-friendly and the Tahoe for sure is not (x-police package and it's a bit beat) and the 98 Formula is basically a race car that I drive on the street.

Here are my choices:

300C
Evo
STi
Neon SRT

I lean a bit to the Evo since it's AWD (Chicago winters) and it seems to have nicer parts than the WRX. Friend just got one for $28K. I like that I might be able to tweak it to mid 12's and still take clients in it... My clients tend to know what rally car and SCCA racing is so they would find the car interesting.

I like the 300C but it's RWD and frankly it's the new pimpsta ride around here.

Talk amongst yourselves, thoughts?

PSJ

98 formula
99 tahoe ls, 2wd, x-mi hwy patrol, 134k, petty blue

FWIW Jeremy has an EVO, and I love his car...with light mods it absolutly humiliates my Trans Am. That said my main objection to the EVO/WRX STi is twofold. First they have a very cheap feeling interior and look like the sub $20K cars they're based on. Secondly they perform to absolutly amazing levels but in a way that causes them to be darty nervous and high-strung in normal driving. For pure driving pleasure for the money they are a fantastic value, and 4-doors and a trunk can't be beat, but the rental car interior and inability to tone down the character of the car's road manners are critical issues for me. Sometimes I want to just run to the store and get some milk and I don't want the Rally car drama these cars require.

Now on the 300C they are releasing both an SRT version and an AWD version this fall (http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=193549&highlight=AWD) so you may want to check them out. (not sure if there will be an AWD SRT though).

Another option if you want to go a little more mature is the SAAB 9-2x which is a reskined non-STi WRX with a nicer interior.
http://www.shadetreemechanic.com/images/Saab%209-2x.jpg

Some other models to consider:
BMW 330i Performance package. 4-doors and E36 M3 performance.
Infinit G35 Sedan and AWD: mid 14s but they have much more upscale interiors than the Subaru.
Subaru Legacy: A little slower than a WRX, both the interior and exterior are a significant step up. There is also a 350hp STi version coming to market shortly: (http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=175694&highlight=Audi)
http://response.jp/issue/2004/0114/article56972_1.images/60776.jpg

I'd consider the following for your needs, though I don't know how real important tweakability is in a daily driver, especially for ferrying around people on business.

2005 Cadillac CTS
http://www.cadillac.com/images/models/cts/gallery/photoExt1_big.jpg
http://www.cadillac.com/images/models/cts/gallery/photoInt1_big.jpg

2005 Chrysler 300C (soon with AWD)
http://www.chrysler.com/300/features/exterior_photos/img/enlarge_8.jpg
http://www.chrysler.com/300/features/exterior_photos/img/enlarge_9.jpg

2005 Dodge Magnum RT (soon with AWD)
http://www.dodge.com/gallery/img/magnum/enlarge_6.jpg
http://www.dodge.com/gallery/img/magnum/enlarge_10.jpg

2005 Pontiac GTO (400HP LS2, and a sedan amount of room in the back for passengers)
http://www.pontiac.com/concept/images/cc_sema_gto2.jpg
http://www.pontiac.com/gto/images/enlarge_image6.jpg

2005 Saab 9-2X
http://9-2x.saabusa.com/images/ext4.jpg
http://9-2x.saabusa.com/images/int1.jpg

2005 Saab 9-3
http://www.saabusa.com/main/US/en/image/photo_gallery/93S/93S_ext_12.jpg
http://www.saabusa.com/main/US/en/image/photo_gallery/93S/93S_int_3.jpg

And none of you mentioned the upcoming Cadillac STS? Also available with AWD provided you opt for the Northstar. Nice pics of nice rides you guys posted. Those shots really bring out the best in those vehicles.

And none of you mentioned the upcoming Cadillac STS?

Starting at $40,995, it's considerably more expensive than the cars he listed.

And frankly, I don't think the new STS will have much, if anything, over a 300C in any respect though it costs thousands more.

Is the Saab only available as a wagon? If you say it's available as a sedan I would be very interested.

300C AWD might be pricey, wanted to stay in the 25-30k range. CTS V6 would make me want a CTS-V.

Is the Saab only available as a wagon? If you say it's available as a sedan I would be very interested.

300C AWD might be pricey, wanted to stay in the 25-30k range. CTS V6 would make me want a CTS-V.I would be all over a SAAB 9-2x Sedan, but sadly I don't think they're offering that yet....damn wierdo Swedes... It's not like WRX wagons are filling the roads or anything. At any rate I think the car looks good with the SAAB styling, but it is regretful it's not an STi-tuned car. I would recomend looking at the Legacy though, it seams like a more substanual car than the WRX. BTW I also looked at a 9-3 and was not impressed by that car at all. FWD and BMW price tag...and the interior was less than spectacular. Haven't driven a 9-2x yet though...

BTW if you're willing to step up to $40K for a used car you can get a 2000 M5 or a 2003 Merc C32. The C32 runs 13.0 flat stock and the guys on the AMG forums have pulled them into the mid to low 12s with a pully swap. After spending time with both though I would take the slower M5, it's much nicer.

I will not consider any used cars for the daily driver.

Anne does not like WRX or 300C. I am not interested in 300C since I'm sure it's a dreadful winter car for up here.

Evo RS (lightweight) is a strong possibility, comes in white or red only.

Saab 92X will not be out in a sedan for the foreseeable future so that's out. They're listing the hatchebacks at $26-29K so it's not much of a deal either.

The selling point on paper of the Evo RS is that it's lighter, does not have that wing, and would sell for like $26,500 but still come with the Enkei wheels and the Brembos.

Any other cars in the $25-30K range that are interesting?

I will not consider any used cars for the daily driver. Thats a shame I was just getting ready to recomend a B4 generation Audi S4. AWD and twin turbo V6, they run the high $20Ks used and pull 13 flat with minimal mods. Not to mention they have a damn nice interior.
Anne does not like WRX or 300C. I am not interested in 300C since I'm sure it's a dreadful winter car for up here. Even with the AWD? As a southerner I have no clue what makes a car a good or bad winter driver. Snow is like cold wet beach sand right? ;)
Evo RS (lightweight) is a strong possibility, comes in white or red only. You don't want the RS, you want the EVO MR Alcantera interior and 300 pounds less than a standard EVO :D
Saab 92X will not be out in a sedan for the foreseeable future so that's out. They're listing the hatchebacks at $26-29K so it's not much of a deal either.It would be a slick car as a sedan. It's also a shame it doesn't get the STi trim, which, for the price, it should.

The selling point on paper of the Evo RS is that it's lighter, does not have that wing, and would sell for like $26,500 but still come with the Enkei wheels and the Brembos.

Any other cars in the $25-30K range that are interesting?
EVO MR
Audi A4 AWD (FWIW the Turbo 4 is really easy to get in the 13s)
VW Touregg V6 (Yes I know it's an SUV, but the interior is the nicest I've seen in an automobile this side of a Range Rover)
Mazda RX8 (not my first choice...very tiny)
G35 Sedan AWD (getting 277hp this year and a new front Fascia)
http://www2.autospies.com/images/uploads/medium/2005-Infiniti-G35-sedan-1.jpg
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=178775&highlight=
FWIW There is a HUGE Selections of Turbos and Superchargers for the new G35. (http://forums.freshalloy.com/ubbthreads/postlist.php?Cat=&Board=UBB25)

You may also be able to get a great deal on a Infiniti M45. I hear rumors they were going for $15K under sticker. The exterior is bland, but it has a great interior and a 345 hp V8.

PS I think the Audi A4 1.8T Quatro starts around $27K so that gives you plenty of mod money to put it in the 13's and still have cash left over for a decent body kit.
http://www.germancarfans.com/photos/3040614.001/1008.jpg

Father'law has a 98 A4 Audo and it's okay.

Evo has the easy potential of mid to high 12's and it would be good in snow.

My co-worker has an EVO. It's a decent car but he's selling it, possibly for the MR. He has a few tweaks from Vischnu (sp?) Performance. His best is a 13.0, but has since blown his front and center diffs. Not an expensive fix, and he's not the only one who's had the problem. I'm quite sure it's a BIG problem with any of the cars that are driven somewhat hard. (as they should be)

Awesome winter car, I drove it during a decent snow storm and the thing was fun as hell. As long as your light on the gas you can get around just fine, but when you get on it, you can get that thing to go crazy. Good fun for sure. The Audi will probably go through the snow a bit better.

It does have 4 doors, but the back seats are nothing great. I didn't fit in them, but I'm 6'4". The Recaros are nice, stops great with the Brembos. I say save the money on the Enkeis and buy some SSRs or the like. My buddy powdercoated his Enkeis black and through snow tires on them. Now his got some silver SSRs and the thing looks pretty good.


IMO, it's a decent car, but I wouldn't buy one. Mitsubishi drivetrain has always been sub par, and there are a few better choices in the field. I would personally take a used S4 over the Evo any day of the week. If your set on the Jap makes though, the is Evo > the STI.

I look at an S4 every day, a guy in my building has one... exterior does not excite me. But I appreciate all the inputs.

I was bored at work today and was looking at GM service information and found that the 05 Pontiac Grand Prix has a listing for a 5.3! Looked like a LS2 style manifold mounted backwards, a totally different front cover arrangement, and displacement of demand. How bout that for a family car. Its still front drive but i guess you cant have everything.

I am not interested in 300C since I'm sure it's a dreadful winter car for up here.

Like every modern RWD car worth it's salt, the 300C is dimensionally balanced (nearly equal weight distribution), and handles winters just as well as any FWD car if not better. The CTS is the same way. That's the beauty of not being front or rear heavy, great handling all year round and traction.

Obviously AWD is better for winter, but none of the RWD cars I listed will leave you stranded.

CTS V6 would make me want a CTS-V.

I took one out with the new 3.6L V6. It's quite powerful, and wheel-hop free, not to mention vastly cheaper.

You might want to drive all these cars before you start crossing them off your list.

I took one out with the new 3.6L V6. It's quite powerful, and wheel-hop free, not to mention vastly cheaper.

You might want to drive all these cars before you start crossing them off your list.Yea, by the numbers the EVO is the winner for sure.... BTW here is my review of the WRX/EVO from last week
http://www.ls1tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=195480&highlight=drove

Anyhow, The new GTO for instance doesn't shine in any objective test, but it's ride and drive is vastly superior to the G35 Coupe, EVO and STi IMOHO. You never know what car might appeal to you.

speaking of another car for you to consider is the Volvo S60R. It has 300hp from a Turbo 5 Cylinder and AWD.... Of course I know getting married and buying a Volvo in the same year might be a traumatic experience ;)
http://www.fantasycars.com/sedans/misc/volvo_s60r.jpg

Great looking interior
http://www.fantasycars.com/sedans/misc/volvo_s60r2.jpg

Love the Blue Gauges
http://www.alexwu.com/pictures/kcc/s60r02.jpg
http://s60r.fadainc.com/pics/Volvo%20035.jpg
MSRP $37,250

-Adam

I am thinking of test driving:

Evo RS
300C 5.7
GTO A4

I thought about buying an S60 R last year, until I drove a few.

To put it bluntly, they're total pieces of crap. A used, previous model S4 is a better way to spend money, and is light years ahead of it in every respect. The Volvo was a very disappointing car.

i'd go with the EVO RS. AWD so its good for winter, and you dont see them as much as the others

i'd go with the EVO RS. AWD so its good for winter, and you dont see them as much as the othersThe 2005 EVO MR is well worth the Money over the RS. It's 300 pounds lighter with an Aluminum Roof, has a 6-speed instead of a 5-speed, Alcantera Faux-Suede Leather Seats.

Stuff lacking onthe RS and standard on the EVO MR and EVO VIII
HID Headlights (Not Available on the RS)
Front Intermittent Variable Wipers and Washers instead of Fixed
Some leather appointments like the hand brake etc
Vanity mirrors, cup holders, center console
Recaro Seats (Leather in EVO VIII, Alcantera in MR)
ABS

2005 EVO MR
http://www.roadandtrack.com/article.asp?section_id=39&article_id=1254&page_number=1
If you have never driven the Mitsubishi Lancer Evolution – better known as an “Evo” – you really are missing something. For starters, it is perhaps the best-steering production car available in America. Throw in wonderful clutch and brake feel, smooth shifting and a very willing and responsive (if a little underpowered) turbocharged four add up to one of the most rewarding-to-drive cars in existence. And there’s no worry when it comes time to bring the experience to a halt, thanks to some very powerful Brembos that slow the Evo down on a par with some of the world’s best sports cars. The new MR version looks to make the Evo an even more enjoyable ride with the addition of a larger turbocharger for improved low- and mid-range power and an extra gear in the form of a new 6-speed gearbox. The MR also sheds about 300 pounds, thanks to a new aluminum roof and lightweight alloy BBS wheels. Improved handling is achieved with even stickier Yokohama Advan tires, revised suspension and Mitsubishi’s famous active center differential, helping to elevate its skidpad number from 0.88g in stock form to a whopping 0.98g for the MR.

And best of all, according to Sam Mitani, the MR is bound for the U.S. “This baby is definitely headed our way,” says the editor of SPEED. Look for the MR to sell for around an amazingly low $33,000.

Here’s a first look at the new Evo MR. To learn more, be sure to pick up the inaugural issue of SPEED when it goes on sale on March 30.


http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/image/0325200420224204.jpg
http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/image/0325200420224208.jpg
http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/image/0325200420224324.jpg
http://www.roadandtrack.com/assets/image/0325200420224193.jpg


Notice that the EVO MR looses the Chrome "Alteza" tail lights too!

"Standard" EVO VIII rear (EVO RS has these tail lights too)
http://www.import-heaven.net/images/specs/mitsubishi_lancer_evo_viii_01.jpg
http://www.shinkaze.com/images/posts/funny/altezzasuper.jpg

I'm not clear when the EVO MR is available.

300C is looking like it's going to be going for sticker, per a sales guy I talked at one dealer near me.

The wifee and I are going over a list of vehicles that we both like based on how they look and my research...

Toureg
Acura TL 6 spd
Evo (she no likee)
GTO
BMW 325-330 AWD
Infiniti G35 Sedan

The wifee and I are going over a list of vehicles that we both like based on how they look and my research...

Toureg
Acura TL 6 spd
Evo (she no likee)
GTO
BMW 325-330 AWD
Infiniti G35 SedanMy Fiancee is in love with the Touring-egg. I have to admit I like it too, amazing interior for the money. She hates the STi/EVO. hmmm....

Yeah, Touareg does have an amazing interior. But, apparently you need the V8 to not feel sluggish, and the V8 models are expensive as ever. And the rear seat is not exactly large (according to reviews/measurements), although I've never been in one.

With my new baby around, we need something new, and I'm happy to say that my Wife actually likes the Magnum.
:D
I'm definitely NOT a mopar guy, but hey, it cruises, has a decent interior. The MB 5spd Auto & ESP.
Hard to beat it @ $29,995.

Mike

Yeah, Touareg does have an amazing interior. But, apparently you need the V8 to not feel sluggish, and the V8 models are expensive as ever. And the rear seat is not exactly large (according to reviews/measurements), although I've never been in one.

With my new baby around, we need something new, and I'm happy to say that my Wife actually likes the Magnum.
:D
I'm definitely NOT a mopar guy, but hey, it cruises, has a decent interior. The MB 5spd Auto & ESP.
Hard to beat it @ $29,995.

MikeMan, I can't believe those new Hemi's are so cheap for what you get. I really wish I liked the styling of the 300C because it would be a great option for me from a technical spec sheet perspective.

On the Twargen, I haven't driven a V6, but the V8 felt sporty as hell. I think the Porsche Cayenne really shines through that chassis. Space was an issue for us as well. The VW is more of a midsized SUV like an X5 or ML, however there is a very good chance that VW will release a third row seat option this year on an extended Toureggy this year. Now if you're rolling in money, VW has also released a 450hp W12 Farfentwarg through VW individual.....but I'm sure it costs about the same or more as the Porsche Cayenne turbo. Cheaper than that,...but still waaaay too expensive for my blood, is to get the V10 TDI and do the Abt conversion:
http://www.germancarfans.com/tuners.cfm/tunerid/7040331.017
373 hp and 860nm of torque!!!
http://www.germancarfans.com/photos/3031118.001/1009big.jpg

Of course even the base FarfenTwarg V10 TDi makes decent power:

From:http://www.germancarfans.com/news.cfm/newsid/2040525.002
As the saying goes, there’s no replacement for displacement, and the V10 offers five liters in 10 cylinders with twin turbochargers (“biturbo”). The Touareg V10 TDI exhibits the ultimate in tractive force and pulling power. Rated at 310 horsepower at 3,750 revolutions per minute and a maximum torque of 553 lbs. ft. at 2,000 rpm, towing capacity is 7,716 lbs., making this Touareg among the strongest SUVs on the road in its class. It is also one of the fastest diesel SUVs in history, achieving 0-60 miles per hour in just 7.5 seconds and a top speed of 130 mph.



Pleasantly, the Touareg V10 TDI achieves an EPA fuel efficiency rating of 23 miles per gallon on the highway and 17 mpg in the city. It also achieves current exhaust emission performance limits in Europe and 45 states in the U.S.

VW tWAr-Gen Sport Concept:
http://www.germancarfans.com/news/2040413.003/2040413.003.1L.jpg


-Adam

I get to drive by a gray Tor-egg every day on the way in, and a Cayenne S. I will admit that I don't really like the styling of the Tor-egg it's way too bland for me. I'm pretty burnt out on driving trucks to be honest.

I like the 300C and we can afford it but Anne thinks it's too thuggy looking.

We considered Mercedes but the 230's with awd seem to be around 40k, and I would not buy a Mercedes without AWD up here. We do too much driving to visit family in the winter.

I am in fact maybe considering a 98 Z/28 that is a rare colour but we'll see if that actually happens. The selling point for me would be the rare colour and the fact that it has less than 40,000 miles on it. Other than that I am mostly focusing on the Acura TL. Any good Car& Driver or Road& Track articles on the TL? 270hp at 6500 sounds pretty good to me. And a 6 spd.

I get to drive by a gray Tor-egg every day on the way in, and a Cayenne S. I will admit that I don't really like the styling of the Tor-egg it's way too bland for me. I'm pretty burnt out on driving trucks to be honest. Now see me, I like the way the Twar-eggasaurus looks. When it comes to SUVs I like bland.... don't like the looks of the Cayenne at all.
I like the 300C and we can afford it but Anne thinks it's too thuggy looking. The Gangsta community agrees with you.
Chrysler 300C: The Next Bling Thing?
Buzz, buzz -- cha-ching, cha-ching. (http://www.thecarconnection.com/index.asp?article=7176)
We considered Mercedes but the 230's with awd seem to be around 40k, and I would not buy a Mercedes without AWD up here. We do too much driving to visit family in the winter. Tried the C class, thought it was too small....for me that is...
I am in fact maybe considering a 98 Z/28 that is a rare colour but we'll see if that actually happens. The selling point for me would be the rare colour and the fact that it has less than 40,000 miles on it. Other than that I am mostly focusing on the Acura TL. Any good Car& Driver or Road& Track articles on the TL? 270hp at 6500 sounds pretty good to me. And a 6 spd. Good looking car, great looking interior, really bad reviews from the fun to drive factor due to FWD and Torque Steer. I think most of the reviews put the G35 Sedan on top.

I'd go with a 330 Performance, that includes:

330 (Perceived) Performance Package
Much to the chagrin of those who recently purchased a 2003 model year 3 series, the 2004 models will be showing up in dealerships in April. Coupes get revised styling incorporating the Adaptive Brake Light technology of the 7 series, while 330 models get a 6 speed manual transmission. A newly available Performance Package is also available on 330 sedans. Included in its $3,900 asking price are:

 A revised camshaft profile that adds 10horsepower
 A throatier exhaust system
 A short-throw shift linkage
 a performance axle ratio (increased to 3.45 from 2.91)
 A new style of 18” wheel with staggered tires in the M3 'differentiated' sizing
 A more agressively tuned suspension than the sport suspension standard on all 330 sedans.
 Revised front and rear bumpers
 the same trunklid spoiler used on the M3
 Alcantara (faux suede) covering for the steering wheel
 Carbon Fiber look interior trim

http://caranddriver.com/image_cache/DATA/Caranddriver/images/autoshow/2003/la/03la_bmw_330i.jpg

How much is that 3 series baddog?

Acura TL is like #3 for luxury sedan by Consumer Reports.

A friend just got one for $31k.

I found two magazine tests, one went 14.5 and the other went 14.8... 14.5 is decent.

2004 BMW 330 4dr Rear-wheel Drive Sedan

MSRP Invoice
Base Price $35,200 $32,190
Destination $695 $695
Selected Options $3,900 $3,550
Total Price $39,795 $36,435

Selected Options
Option Description MSRP Invoice
NONEN Engine: Specially Tuned 3.0L I6 DOHC SMPI N/C N/C
NONTN Transmission: Performance 6-Speed Manual N/C N/C
NONTR3 Tires: 225/40R18 Fr & 255/35R18 Rr Performance N/C N/C
787 Wheels: Double Spoke Cast Alloy (Styling 135M) N/C N/C
481 Sport Seats N/C N/C
G7~~ Alcantara/Cloth Seat Trim N/C N/C
PAINT Monotone Paint Application STD STD
STDRD Radio: AM/FM Stereo w/CD STD STD
ZHP Performance Package $3,900 $3,550

Next to the GTO, the 330i Performance was the car I wanted.

But, the way I wanted one it would have ended up being $44k before taxes, and that's not far off the CTS-V's price. That ended up giving me pause.

Having an automatic for a daily driver has its advantages...

I would consider the Dodge Magnum Hemi with AWD thats due out in October.

Actually any of the cars mentioned are winners...

If you want a stick shift the Suby WRX Sti or Evo do make for some fun if not totally a luxury ride...(good for modding though)

Daily drivers should be luxury oriented .....which is why I chose the Dodge Magnum AWD hemi due in Oct.

Not as strong a demand as the 300C so there 's more flexibility in pricing..IMHO..

I say you'll get out the door for 30 grand plus tax when all is said and done.

Since the 300C's are like $33K why would the Magnum AWD be cheaper? I called around and dealers told me that they were selling the cars for sticker or a little under. They sticker for like $35-36K. I would think AWD version would be like $38K MSRP.

3 Series sounds interesting but they are crap snow cars and I live in the snow belt. I could consider getting a set of snow rims so I might go check one out.

Since the 300C's are like $33K why would the Magnum AWD be cheaper? I called around and dealers told me that they were selling the cars for sticker or a little under. They sticker for like $35-36K. I would think AWD version would be like $38K MSRP.

3 Series sounds interesting but they are crap snow cars and I live in the snow belt. I could consider getting a set of snow rims so I might go check one out.

Calling on the phone usually will get dealers to state list especially on the 300C. I believe the Magnum to be 31,500 plus tax for the hemi and AWD or thereabouts..

DC is giving about 1,000 on every car including the 300C and the Magnum..

If you stay light on options just getting the Hemi supposedly 31,500 should do it..then take the grand off? your at 30 grand plus tax..

Thats what I would get but to each his own!

Good luck..

PS. My wife dislikes the Magnum :lol:

Magnum sedan AWD is not out yet so really the MSRP is not know yet at this time.

300C's are at 36K around here. Not sure on invoice but I doubt $30K is possible. I called a few dealers and to be honest they were pretty honest and direct.

Adam, you and I share very similar tastes. . . I'd LOVE to have the TT Diesel V10 Touareg, but I'm looking to spend ~$30k, not $60k.

John, after seeing the following video: http://www.dcxmediaservices.com/videoptrs/wms/dctv/Mar04/Houghton_Ride_Drive_300k.wvx

I wouldn't even be concerned with sending my wife out in the snow with my daughter in the back. It's 4100 lbs and has one of the best traction control systems out there. I think it'd move fine in 8 inches or less of snow. I don't know where it would start getting rough, but it's not like driving a Bimmer 3 series in the snow.

Mike

Magnum sedan AWD is not out yet so really the MSRP is not know yet at this time.

300C's are at 36K around here. Not sure on invoice but I doubt $30K is possible. I called a few dealers and to be honest they were pretty honest and direct.FYI if you get a beemer you really should do European Delivery. Not too many dealers will do that, however a friend of mine did that on his 545 sport which listed at $65,000. By doing European delivery it cut the cost of the car down to $58,000, not only paying for the trip but also it effectivly gave him a $7K down payment on his lease giving him nothing payments.. ($500-$600/month I think..not bad for a $65K car). I don't think the E-Delivery discount is quite as much on the 3-series, but it's worth looking into. Effectivly you're buying the car from BMW-Germany rather than BMW-north America, so all that mark-up is cut out, and they give you an American-Spec car, you fly over, drive it in Europer for however long you like, drop it off at one of their drop off points, then, less than two months later it's sitting at your dealership all prepped and ready to go.

FWIW on the 300 Performance, I've heard really good things about this package including it more or less performance on par with the previous generation M3. (High praise indeed). Don't think it would make a good snow-car though.

I don't think the 300c or Magnum would make a GOOD snow car, just that the Chicago winters aren't really too bad. IMO, ABS and Traction control are the essentials. In the Chi-town area, we never really have a ton of snow on the ground for too long.

Automatic tranny Fbodies w/ RSA's & traction control get around just fine during the winter here in Chicago. Add 600lbs and a superior TC, and you're good to go.

The Magnum RT is a few thousand cheaper than a comparable 300C.

The dealer here discounts both of them about $3k off sticker and moves them. The invoice on a Magnum RT is $27k and the MSRP is $29k with no options.

I don't think the 300c or Magnum would make a GOOD snow car, just that the Chicago winters aren't really too bad. IMO, ABS and Traction control are the essentials. In the Chi-town area, we never really have a ton of snow on the ground for too long.

Automatic tranny Fbodies w/ RSA's & traction control get around just fine during the winter here in Chicago. Add 600lbs and a superior TC, and you're good to go.Just for clarification when I said I don't thnk the 300 would make a good snow car I actually was intending to type the BMW 330-Performance probably isnt a good snow car.

John,

Go check out the new Legacy GT Limited, and then let me drive it when you come home after purchasing it... :D Looks kind of similar to the Acura TL. Interior is very nice, far and above WRX or Evo. 250 hp/250tq 2.5 liter turbo. Kind of like a detuned version of the STi, but more powerful and torquey than a regular WRX. Weight is less than 100 lbs more than a WRX. 5 speed trans for auto or manual (stronger than WRX tranny). Should be about 14.1 at 98 mph, stock. And of course low 13's would be a few tweaks away. This car won Japan's Car of the Year for 2004. And of course AWD for the winter...

My "tweaked" WRX is still going fine after 63,000 miles, by the way. :)

http://www.import-heaven.net/specs_subaru_legacy_gt.shtml for more stats and basic info.

http://www.import-heaven.net/images/specs/subaru_legacy_gt_02.jpg
http://www.import-heaven.net/images/specs/subaru_legacy_gt_01.jpg
http://memimage.cardomain.com/member_images/5/web/497000-497999/497902_15_full.jpg

I 2nd the Legacy GT Limited.

While I don't think I'll go for one, because I'm going used in order to get a higher end car (used XJR, 740i Sport,540 or M5), If I was buying new I'd have that Legacy right in there with the G35, 300C/Magnum, and Acura TL. Go drive one. And talk about room for mods, it's the detuned STi engine - 250hp 250ft-lb. With a cobb accesport and a downpipe you can be up to 300ish horsepower at the flywheel.

On the other hand I don't like the EVO or the WRX, they are a little too rinky-dink for my tastes. For a daily driver/road trip sedan, I don't want a car the size of a Cavalier, no matter how fast it is. I need something with some presence and style.

Definitely will keep it in mind. I think the Evo and the WRX stuff is probably too boy racer for us to have as a daily driver... If it was just me I might go for the
Evo but I know it has a harsh ride and it's still a compact car.