Stereo & Electronics - dam my new sub has excellent sound quailty but has it's limits

I think I've got my new indinidy sub (prefect 10.1 Kappa) tuned pretty close (gain & freq. of amp) what I have observed is at mid volume (thats my normal level) the sound quailty is excellent then I can crank up on the RF remote base nob but only half way anymore it distrots.

should I be happy / this or should I consider a more powerfull amp?
current amp RF 250RMS ( RF is underated real world power is 275rms sub rated at 350 rms (max) this dude told me I will not get anymore sound quailty just more volume.

Thanks for advice

I'm really liking this speaker compared to the other crap I've had I now can see this thing getting ready to snowball been checking prices expect to pay ____ for a nice mid volume sys? like HU separets for doors then co-axs for sails?

Usually you'll want to give a sub or any speaker for that matter the amount that there rated for, maybe a little more. Give it another 100 watts and it'll get alot louder without distortion. Underpowering a speaker can damage it if your pushing it to distortion, in this case you might already be pushing the limits of the amp. If I rember correctly someone said that a remote bass control will only adjust the volume around a certain frequency.

Underpowering is only detremental if you are pushing a distorted signal to the sub, but sadly many people do not recognise when this is happening so more subs are destroyed due to people running with smaller amps than those using larger ones. Anytime you don't have volume turned all the way up you are feeding the sub much less power than its rating, this does not destroy the sub. But more power will give you a little extra margin for safety when you are cranking the volume.

Here is what you can expect by adding more power.

It won't be a lot louder with an extra 100 watts, but you will gain 2 - 3db.

Now if you add another sub and give them each 200w you will gain 5-6db.

Now if you add an extra sub and give them each 350w you will gain 8-9 db, which will sound almost twice as loud. An increase of 10db sounds twice as loud to the human ear.

Your amp is running out of power when you use the bass boost knob (it still isn't a volume control). If you want the type of sound you get from cranking that knob up, you really should consider a ported enclosure. With the same driver you can gain an easy 5-6 db at 40hz and 6-10db at 30hz without the extra load on your amp. The net result is that it will be louder for only the cost of some wood and/or fiberglass.

dos'nt seam worth the amp up grade for just 2-3 dB gain, not considering the alternatives (only want one sub).

now building a new box sounds OK but this ported box will have to be much bigger my current box is a tad small .6 cubic' the recommended ported box size is 1 cubic'

I do like the base knob effect so if I make a new ported box I will have the knob effect without cranking on knob so if I crank on knob /ported box it'll sound twice as good or will it sound boomie?

dum ? about box size this is without speaker right?

I have been recently told that over powering a speaker wears it out much quicker than mildly powering it. just use common sense with the volume knob and expect the sub to last a long time / either power level.

I have made a grille I'll post images later, just could'nt seam to find a desent grille. can I use a old Tshirt streched over the grille or will this muffle the sound waves?

Thanks

what I have observed is at mid volume (thats my normal level) the sound quailty is excellent then I can crank up on the RF remote base nob but only half way anymore it distrots. If the amp gain setting isn't already maxed out, try turning the remote bass know to a little bit lower than the limit at which it distorts and the turning the gain on the amp up. If that distorts, try turning the remote bass down a little more This should give you more overall volume from the sub.

From this and your other threads it sounds like the bass boost in the amp is what's giving you the distortion. since the gain knob determines how much power the amplifier amplifies with.

I'm not exactly sure if this will help your situation. I guessing you want more power w/o distortion out of the sub at high volumes? Also keep the EQ sliders on the Monsoon headunit at or below halfway. Like I've said before, I've noticed that the sound quality goes downhill fast after boosting those higher.

Cliffs: I think the problem is in the remote bass boost OR the Monsoon level's being over halfway up.

yeh I've heard a few here are not fans of the bass knobs.

currently the amp gain is set 50% I'll try turning the EQ slider down some then adjust up more on amp gain. I don't really like to have my EQ sliders at halfway because then I'll lose some midbase. you're advice here do'es make sence.

not really expecting more volume but would like to use all the base knob without any distrosion (not just for SQ but also to protect my new investment).

Tuesday I plan to connect the LCA to the left side sail panel (currently it's only connected to the right) maybe this will improve stuff..

just replaced another sail panel and noticed where it was damaged the rubber ring was detached from the paper woofer is this speaker trashed or can it be glued back it did play a mid to low volume but toward the end it was cracking bad.

Thanks

yeh I've heard a few here are not fans of the bass knobs.

currently the amp gain is set 50% I'll try turning the EQ slider down some then adjust up more on amp gain. I don't really like to have my EQ sliders at halfway because then I'll lose some midbase. you're advice here do'es make sence.What I do is put all of the sliders lower relative to what I want to stand out, and then I leave what I want to hear the most at half way, and then turn the volume up. Currently my sliders are in a bit of a bowl configuration if you look at them. The lowest and highest frequencies are right in the middle, and the middle frequency is about 2/3s of the way to the bottom from the middle, and everything else just kinda fills in the shape. If you mess with moving the lowest three sliders up to half way or slightly below it, and everything else somewhere below their setting, the midbass should stand out.

not really expecting more volume but would like to use all the base knob without any distrosion (not just for SQ but also to protect my new investment).You might be able to use the bass knob more if having the Monsoon EQ sliders below halfway fixes the distortion issues. It's starting to look like the problem is in how that is set up. :chug:

just replaced another sail panel and noticed where it was damaged the rubber ring was detached from the paper woofer is this speaker trashed or can it be glued back it did play a mid to low volume but toward the end it was cracking bad.

Thanks

My right sail panel speaker has the foam separated from the paper just over a third of the way around, duct tape hasn't worked in keeping it together for more than a day or two, so soon I'm gonna try gorilla glue. :jest:

I have my EQ set simiarl more of a v though middle slider to bottom far right about a 1/8" from top same / left slider rest evenly spaced inbetween. I like the base effect. so I'll just reduce each slider then crank on gain of amp with base knob wide open ( I think this is where RF has misinformed me they say leave it disconnected I'm thinking now that if it's WO when I set amp gain, volume can only go down and never distort)

Dam I've been just throwing out the previous blown sails never really took the time to exaime it. let me know if the gorilla glue works.

here's the ? you missed.

Tuesday I plan to connect the LCA to the left side sail panel (currently it's only connected to the right) maybe this will improve stuff

Thanks

now building a new box sounds OK but this ported box will have to be much bigger my current box is a tad small .6 cubic' the recommended ported box size is 1 cubic'


You will need a bigger box, if you build it as 1 cuft total internal, ignoring the space taken up by the port and driver, you will get a more pronounced peak around 40 hz at the expence of some low end extension. If you build taking driver displacement and port displacement into account, you will lose ~2db @40hz but gain 2db at 30hz. Not a huge difference, but that should give you an idea of the outcome. Personally I would go with the bigger box as it will be safer for your driver.

I do like the base knob effect so if I make a new ported box I will have the knob effect without cranking on knob so if I crank on knob /ported box it'll sound twice as good or will it sound boomie?

Well, that is a matter of taste. I would probibly call your current setup with the bass knob WO (as you call it) boomie, but to each his own. What you desire is not an SQ system, you are wanting a getto thumper. there is nothing wrong with that, I am pointing this out to help you in the future. You will get better suggestions and advise when you ask for what you really want. With a ported box, it will sound like you have the bass knob a little under half way when it is set at 0.

Now, and I really want you to pay attention here, there is absolutely no reason you should ever have that knob over 1/3 of the way up. It is not a volume control! It will never be a volume control! It was never intended to be a volume control! By turning that knob up, you are essentially turning all frequencies above and below 40hz down, you gain nothing. Ok I am better now, sorry I had to do that.

I have made a grille I'll post images later, just could'nt seam to find a desent grille. can I use a old Tshirt streched over the grille or will this muffle the sound waves?


An old thin cotton T-shirt will work fine, or you can go to a fabric store and get some single knit polyester cloth (it's kinda stretchy) for cheap.

A speaker isn't always operating at its rated power lever. That is, when actually operating, the driver is not pulling in that amount of power consistently. It all varies with what is being played. There are peaks and valleys.

The alpine type R sub I have in my setup is rated at 500 wrms. Given the natural gain of the cabin itself, I doubt I even have 150 w or more going to the sub at peak,

You should probably invest in a better amp and/or HU. From your posts, it is difficult to determine how your system is actually set up. Remember GIGO.

Also, please consider investing in a spelling checker, or at least proofreading your posts.

A speaker isn't always operating at its rated power lever.

.......

Also, please consider investing in a spelling checker, or at least proofreading your posts.

:jest: yeah, at least proofread your post :jest:

But seriously, no amp is going to do 18db of bass boost (that is what his knob does when WO) cleanly unless you turn the gain way down. that 45hz spike needs 32 times the power the rest of the frequency spectrum needs when that knob is turned all the way up. For example, with the knob cranked to a full 18db of boost, when the 45hz spike needs full amplifier power, the rest of the audio spectrum is only getting about 10 watts.

I do agree GIGO and a headunit would improve the audio quality, but I think the problem with the amp is unrealistic expectations.

TA Guy I thought you understood that I preferr SQ over the boomie ghetto blasting that was the whole point of upgrading my sub / this nice infinidy.

so you guys are saying this RF amp is a POS P2502 I only gave $150. if yes then please recommend a replacement.


this ? seams to get overlooked
Wensday I plan to connect the LCA to the left side sail panel (currently it's only connected to the right) maybe this will improve stuff


working on spelling.

Thanks

TA Guy I thought you understood that I preferr SQ over the boomie ghetto blasting that was the whole point of upgrading my sub / this nice infinidy.

so you guys are saying this RF amp is a POS P2502 I only gave $150. if yes then please recommend a replacement.



I thought that was what you wanted, but then you say that you want to be able to turn the bass boost knob all the way up. This does not represent a SQ configuration. For SQ you are aiming for flat in-car responce, making the recording sound as true to the producers intentions as possible, that is not what you are getting when you crank on that knob (which you say you really like to do, and want to turn it up even more), that is more of a thumper (my definition of a thumper anyway, it may differ from your definition) That is not a bad thing, at least half the people I have helped in real life (not online) have had the same mis-conceptions about what SQ means. The important thing is if it sounds good to you, if you want more low end bass, build the ported box, I think you will be thrilled with the results. You will of coures get guys telling you all sorts of BS about ported sucks, it has no SQ, etc... don't pay any attention to them, just build the new box and see what you think of it, when you have others listen to it get their impressions before you tell them it is ported, if fact, tell them is is sealed, you'll get more honnest feedback that way. Plus, you can always sell it for the cost of materials if you don't like it.

I think your amp is fine, you just need to build a box which better suits your taste in sound reproduction.