Automotive News, Media & Press - Yet another reason not to read the auto rags

Yep, Car and Driver compared the Z06, 911 turbo and the F430 and skewed their results horribly. In the "World Cup of Sports Cars", the finishing order was from slowest to fastest: F430, 911, Z06. WTF, how do you place the slowest most expensive, 3x more than the Z06, car first place in a sports car competition? :confused: Since I started reading LS1tech stuff I have learned that they can't drive and to use the 5&5 rule, subtract 5 tenths and add 5 mph. I always knew they were a bit biased, but would usually come through with the right winner in a comparison when it was a clear victor. It destroyed the 911 with 1.7 second faster laptimes and they didn't even pother writing how slow the 430 was compared to it. It out accelerated, out handled, and out braked the other two cars in a performance comparison and placed last because it had a "cheap interior". Do I have to mention the other cars were 2 and 3 times the price? :bang: They have gone from an unreliable source of slightly biased information, to clinicly insane. Everyone, please don't pay these people to publish this trash, I won't pick any up when I go the store from now on, despite the pretty pictures.

http://www.caranddriver.com/comparisons/11326/comparison-test-review-2006-chevrolet-corvette-z06-vs-2006-ferrari-f430-vs-2007-porsche-911-turbo.html

Yup, i saw that mag in the store yesterday and flipped through it. Needless to say i thought the same thing you did.

I gave up on C&D years ago. The last straw for me was when they did a comparison involving the Silverado, F150 and (then new) Ram. After completely embarrassing the F150 and Ram in acceleration, towing, hauling, off-road handling, and fuel mileage, the Silverado lost to the Ram because it had less rear headroom. In that same issue they did a feature comparo involving just about all the midsize SUVs available. The Traiblazer was included, and again the truck out-accelerated, out-towed, and out-hauled all but one of the competitions offerings...they even praised it's interior and roominess. Then gave it sixth place because it "rode like a truck". Holy shit there's a revelation!! IT IS A TRUCK!!!

Morons.

Most people will never drive their 450+ hp machines at 10/10ths. With that being said, most magazines don't rank the vehicles they drive based solely on their performance at 10/10ths. There are other things to factor in. Tenths of a second aren't everything when you start hitting the upper eschelon of the performance envelope. Take the Ferrari Enzo, Mercedes SLR McLaren and the Porsche Carrera GT. Three 600+ hp machines but three completely different approaches. Depending on your driving style, transmission preferences, convenience requirements, interior quality, fit and finish, opinion regarding exterior style etc... everyone will rank these three cars differently. The same goes for the F430, 911 and Z06. You're only looking that performance figures and because of that you rank the three cars accordingly. IMO I'd probably rank either the 911 or Z06 first, with the Ferrari trailing the other two because of personal preference. But introduce an Aston Martin V8 Vantage into the comparison and even if it is down 125hp on the Z06 I'd still take it because I like what I like.

My point is, keep in mind that magazines take other factors into consideration when declaring a winner in a comparo. If the Corvette had won there'd be Ferrari owners saying "who gives a shit if the Corvette is a few ticks faster, it's still an unrefined piece of shit and you can tell after driving both back to back." I'm sure right now there are also Porsche owners saying that the 911 is the best of both worlds so why isn't it number 1? ALL reviews are subjective unless they're based solely on performance figures. I mean this past year the Ford GT won Evo's car of the year award. Probably wouldn't have been my first choice based on the lineup they had but hey... ALL REVIEWS ARE SUBJECTIVE. Get over it dude. You still have your opinion don't you?

Then gave it sixth place because it "rode like a truck".

THat is a load of bull right there! My dad test drove a Trailblazer and came back to me and said he would never buy one cause they ride too much like a car... Typical car and driver... Do all other companies except for GM have stakes in that mag or something?

Most people will never drive their 450+ hp machines at 10/10ths. With that being said, most magazines don't rank the vehicles they drive based solely on their performance at 10/10ths. There are other things to factor in. Tenths of a second aren't everything when you start hitting the upper eschelon of the performance envelope. Take the Ferrari Enzo, Mercedes SLR McLaren and the Porsche Carrera GT. Three 600+ hp machines but three completely different approaches. Depending on your driving style, transmission preferences, convenience requirements, interior quality, fit and finish, opinion regarding exterior style etc... everyone will rank these three cars differently. The same goes for the F430, 911 and Z06. You're only looking that performance figures and because of that you rank the three cars accordingly. IMO I'd probably rank either the 911 or Z06 first, with the Ferrari trailing the other two because of personal preference. But introduce an Aston Martin V8 Vantage into the comparison and even if it is down 125hp on the Z06 I'd still take it because I like what I like.

My point is, keep in mind that magazines take other factors into consideration when declaring a winner in a comparo. If the Corvette had won there'd be Ferrari owners saying "who gives a shit if the Corvette is a few ticks faster, it's still an unrefined piece of shit and you can tell after driving both back to back." I'm sure right now there are also Porsche owners saying that the 911 is the best of both worlds so why isn't it number 1? ALL reviews are subjective unless they're based solely on performance figures. I mean this past year the Ford GT won Evo's car of the year award. Probably wouldn't have been my first choice based on the lineup they had but hey... ALL REVIEWS ARE SUBJECTIVE. Get over it dude. You still have your opinion don't you?


These are 2 door sports cars so the only real test is performance.If you want a quality ride interior fit and finish you need to buy a BMW 700 series. Hell the enzo dont look to comfortable to me!

These are 2 door sports cars so the only real test is performance.If you want a quality ride interior fit and finish you need to buy a BMW 700 series. Hell the enzo dont look to comfortable to me!

If everyone thought that way then everyone would be driving Z06s... but they aren't. Last I checked F430s and 911s didn't have problems with their roofs flying off. Things like build quality still matter even when you're playing with big power figures and low ETs. Contrary to what you might think, there are other factors to consider besides strict performance numbers even when you're purchasing rides at the upper echelon of the performance envelope.

Those mag's are for old men with too much money. They generally don't know much about cars. Have to remember, mag's write to a certain audience.

Reliability can't be a factor for winning a comparo then, because while I'm unsure of Porsche, Ferraris are far from reliable.

And they may be high quality at first, but drive them around and after 15 years you'll think you're in a rattle-trap, electro-bugged machine. They're terrible.

And while this won't win a comparo either, atleast a ZO6 doesn't need a complete tune-up/full service after only 15K miles.

If the ZO6 was priced closer to $200K and came from any other country but the US, but was still the exact same car that it is, (or any domestic for that matter), their magazine comparo rankings would be MUCH higher.... hence why I never judge a car based on what a mag ranks it at with its opponents.

I hate those mags,they are a joke,nuff said. Iread that article and it made me sick

Guys, they are not looking at just numbers here, its the feel of the car. Before I go on, I must say I would take the Z06 out of the three, and I agree that I wouldnt pay 3 times as much for a car that doesnt perform as well, and is likley to break down way before the Z06. But they are going by how the car feels when driving fast. In that article it states that the Z06 feels the least planteted to the ground, and its chassis doesnt communicate nearly as much as the others. The other 2 have better brake and steering feel as well. And form what Ive read, on a bumpy road you become more of a passenger than a driver in the Z06. One of the main problems is the runcraps the Z06 has, Id love to see a comparo with these three all wearing the same tires.

I read that article as well....I was so excited when I initially flipped through the pages. I saw the Z06 whooping some ass. So I bought it and took it home and got all giddy as I sat down to read it. It's not even bathroom reading material, so I threw it away. What a waste of $4.00. I agree that there are more factors than performance involved, but they slammed the Z06 for it's shifter and ride quality, then turned around and slammed the 911 for the same things. It's sad, because performance and price should far outweigh it's quality. I mean c'mon, who buys these cars for their ride or comfort. We all know what the consumer has in mind when they drive these off the lot. If that's how the comparo's are going to be, they need to keep the Z06 out and use something else that is "worthy".

Believe it or not, I actually like C&D best of the "big three" rags. IMO they do have some whitty writing every now and then along with some interesting articles (E85, diesel, etc., come to mind). On the other hand, MT lost me a long time ago with their wacko Kalifornia editor, who insists on dogging everything built in USA, and R&T might as well be called European Cars Monthly. With all that said, I just KNEW this is how this test was going to turn out before I even opened the issue. Its just bound to be this way in the mainstream car rags and it'll probably never change.

IMO, the problem is that, just as Todd pointed out, the target audience are gray hairs with limited automotive knowledge that want bragging rights at the clubhouse. They NEED to see who's #1 to feed the ego and they want to sound informed in the process. They can then brag about the "tactile feel and texture" of the interior materials or the "precise feedback" of the steering or the cutting-edge technology of the "multi-valve" engines in their $150k car. Its not enough to just know that there are many great cars that serve differing purposes.

If it were up to me, the rags would not rank the cars per se. Instead they would test them, lay out the facts and data, note the driver's impressions, note weak points AND suggested fixes (this is a big one IMO - eg. after the 100th time they've ripped the T56 for stuff like CAGS and rubbery shifters without mentioning the easy fixes involved), and lose the BS subjective crap like "gotta have it" factor. Let me be the judge of what I "gotta have" and if you can't quantify "feel" then don't base a decision on it. Give me something constructive to work with, ya know? I probably wouldn't sell many mags either, though. Face it, rankings and sensationalism sell in today's world and I don't see this being much different.

Bottom line for me is that, while I would gladly TAKE any of the subject cars, there is only one that I would actually BUY. Am extremely impressed and proud that the new Z kicks the dogshit out of the big boys in their suits and ties and does it on a budget. No amount of interior quality can erase the look on Mr. Ferrari's face when he watches that well-endowed, yet gorgeous Z06 butt getting smaller in front of him. :jest:

Funny...all these years I was under the impression that when things are compared...the one with the higher marks WINS THE COMPARISON....hmmm...damn relative thinking.

Believe it or not, I actually like C&D best of the "big three" rags. IMO they do have some whitty writing every now and then along with some interesting articles (E85, diesel, etc., come to mind). On the other hand, MT lost me a long time ago with their wacko Kalifornia editor, who insists on dogging everything built in USA, and R&T might as well be called European Cars Monthly. With all that said, I just KNEW this is how this test was going to turn out before I even opened the issue. Its just bound to be this way in the mainstream car rags and it'll probably never change.

I think all THREE of them are on TOYota's AND Honduh's payrolls!! :jest:

The magazines print material based on testing/driving experiences of the writers and their counter-part team of employees--it's going to be opinionated. The process here is no different than any regular news network: They report and you decide. I'm content with C&D and pick up R&T if something flashy happens to be on the cover--its how it works heh.

The fact that the Z06 whipped those other cars by the numbers is enough for me. Sure the leather in the Ferrari is from a cow named Heidi, but I'd expect that from a $200K car, and that seems to be whats most important to the people in that mag. Thats not whats most important to me. I think where they go wrong is they write as if their opinion is fact.


I just look at the numbers and put the mag back on the shelf.

Well if money were no object, I'd take the Ferrari over the Z06 any day of the week. The Ferrari is an awesome machine, beautiful, and not every grey haired geeser has one, like the Vette.

The Vette is also an awesome machine, but Car and Driver was right on slamming the interior, it still sucks.

I think ya'll are missing the point. Did you see the part where they said it was "the best performance bargin in the world"? At the end of the day, winning a comparo is more than just getting the best numbers on a page. It's opinion, they even will say so. If theirs doesn't match yours, so what? Lots of things out there don't match up to what I specifically like, it doesn't mean I don't welcome an opposing insight or point of view. I love the LSX series engines, but my loyalty does not blind me to a car's shortcomings if it has one in it.

its just like when motor trend said that the ridgeline was truck of the year, yet its a FREAKING UNIBODY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! last in towing, off roading, and power yet has truck of the year

ChaseSS is right.. when I first heard "WTH honda made a truck?" I responded with 15 minutes of absolute laughter... And proceeded after I saw the reviews..

I have heard everybodies arguments, and everyone made good points. Unfortunately, since I have read every comparo since 1998, I can tell you this, it all depends on how the editors/writers want to spin the comparo. I read all three, and after much evaluation, the vette was kicked down to come in last because the editors/writers were biased, and automatically went into the comparo oodling there love for the Ferrari..... not to include the fact, you can make anything win any comparo, by playing up a certain charachteristic of that car. In other words, they could have said the 911 was first, because it handled the best, or they could have said the Z06 won, because it was the fastest, but no, they played up the refinement and got to have factor (exclusevity).... Basically, when you are comparing top of the line sports cars, then all that should matter are the performance numbers, because numbers don't lie. I would have forgave C&D, if the Vette took 2nd, purely on its perf, but this time, it was to much. Needless to say, I will be canceling my subscription..... and if C&D sees a large number of patrons canceling subsriptions, then well, those numbers don't lie either.......

Yeah, the Truck of the year award in MT should've gone to the new Ram and everyone knows it. Look at the numbers again if you'd like to be pissed off at their editors for playing themselves into Honda's pockets.

Funny thing about C&D [and some other auto mags] is typically, when you read reviews, they always talk about performance, even for a family grocery getter. "we liked the car, but it is outhandled and outperformed by competition, hence we have to place it last". -VERY typical. A guys is getting a Camry for his grandma, for Christ sake. She cannot even stand hard acceleration or cornering, period. She could just have a heart attack or worse. No matter. Every car comparison, no matter what it's duties. That's one of the reason why modern family cars - accords and altimas get 250+ hp engines. Typically magazines won't even complain about fuel economy penalties. When have you even seen a mag complain about too much power? Bigger engine is always better. Fine.

And yet, when they finally decided to compare PERFORMANCE cars, performance was not actually a factor at all :jest:

- just tells you what's already been said - it's not a question of subjective opinions or opinions at all. Editors/writers are just people and they have to write in a way so that they get paid. In that case I can imagine several reasons, not the last one - to please Ferrari owners AND have Z06-lovers, most of whom cannot afford a Ferrari anyways, go get the magazine and talk about it.

You guys sound like you've never read a rag article from these guys.

Like has already been mentioned, they write to a specific audience and the bottom line is readers and money. This is there job and they're going to write to the people that put a paycheck in there pocket. Most people I know that are "car nuts" don't read any of those rags because they already know how the reviews are gonna turn out without reading them, it's utterly blatently bias.

It should come as no suprise as these rags have, and always will be, biased towards towards European cars.

I thought about ordering a subscription but decided against it once I read this crap :(

"On paper, the Z06 Corvette is the best car here. It accelerates as quickly as the 911 Turbo through the quarter and wastes both the Porsche and Ferrari at speeds above 120 mph. How about 0 to 150 mph in 17.7 seconds? That’s up there in Ford GT territory, if not as stupid fast as a McLaren F1. The Z06 has the most grip at 1.01 g and the best braking performance. On an autobahn, it was still accelerating while the Ferrari was topped out in sixth gear at 186 mph. Around our road course, it was an easy victor, 1.7 seconds quicker than the Porsche on a near-76-second lap. It does all this for about a third of the Ferrari’s price. The Z06 is the best performance value in the world, period."

the rest of the article is just :turd: !!!!!!
MARK GILLIES=:supergay:

NUFF SAID!!!!

...And of course the TRUTH is that the Z06 while faster in certain areas, even overall on a given lap etc, is nowhere near as enjoyable to drive. Shocker.

if you can't quantify "feel" then don't base a decision on it.


THANK YOU. in that very article the z06 stopped the shortest distance of all 3 yet was ranked lowest in braking cuz it didn't have good pedal "feel". well the pedal on that z06 is going to feel AWESOME when i'm stopped watching the 911 and the ferrari smash into a wall

yea magazine represents the corvette well in saying its the "performance value in the world, period",they only gave it last place because it keeps up/leaves the cars that costs 2x 3x as much,assholes,and thats one of the many reasons i love the z06

There is some prestige in owning a ferrari or porsche over a corvette. I've never driven any of the three, but you have to realize it's feel not numbers. Why did people buy corvettes in 1994 when the same engine was in a camaro? You can't just look at the dollar equivalent to performance. You could build a car that would smoke the new corvette in the quarter for half the price of a corvette. A few tenths can easily be made up or lost by the driver. People value different things in anything. A magazine doesn't change anything about the corvette. I would take a ferrari over a corvette, you can beat me by a few tenths, but I can do your daughter.

Well, of course, there's more exclusivity in owning an exotic European sports car, but it's asinine not to say that objective PERFORMANCE numbers shouldn't be 90% of the criteria considered in a PERFORMANCE car test.

fuck those magazines and shit. those old hairy fuckers hav to much money jsut like that nut gobbler off top gear.

its just like when motor trend said that the ridgeline was truck of the year, yet its a FREAKING UNIBODY!!!!!!!!!!!!!! last in towing, off roading, and power yet has truck of the year

Um... i'm glad to see you've researched this so thoroughly. You do realize that Honda invited basically every auto writer in the country to come test drive a Ridgeline and it's competitors back to back with 5,000 pound trailers right? And the Ridgeline was more stable and outhandled them like nothing.

If people were a lot more realistic about what they needed in a truck it'd be great. Sure there are a fair amount that go offroading or tow bigger trailers and that's not what the Ridgeline is designed for (and face it, 75% of trucks will never see either).

It's a unibody, boohoo. Of course it is. Better handling, lighter weight, etc. etc. Honda is not going to build a body on frame truck just like they're not going to build a car with a solid rear axle. Why? Because it's ancient technology and there are better ways to do things. Convincing people it's better? Especially in a market where everyone has to be macho and own a big bad truck that is impractical to drive and has 5x more towing capacity than they'll ever use is a challenge though.

In other words, the Ridgeline does what it needs to very well and that's why it won truck of the year. If only it wasn't ugly it'd sell. :jest:

yea car and driver has a bunch of skeptics who think other stuff is more important than performance. Trips me out..

Um... i'm glad to see you've researched this so thoroughly. You do realize that Honda invited basically every auto writer in the country to come test drive a Ridgeline and it's competitors back to back with 5,000 pound trailers right? And the Ridgeline was more stable and outhandled them like nothing.

If people were a lot more realistic about what they needed in a truck it'd be great. Sure there are a fair amount that go offroading or tow bigger trailers and that's not what the Ridgeline is designed for (and face it, 75% of trucks will never see either).

It's a unibody, boohoo. Of course it is. Better handling, lighter weight, etc. etc. Honda is not going to build a body on frame truck just like they're not going to build a car with a solid rear axle. Why? Because it's ancient technology and there are better ways to do things. Convincing people it's better? Especially in a market where everyone has to be macho and own a big bad truck that is impractical to drive and has 5x more towing capacity than they'll ever use is a challenge though.

In other words, the Ridgeline does what it needs to very well and that's why it won truck of the year. If only it wasn't ugly it'd sell. :jest:
infiniti recently invited a shit load of soccer moms and recently divorced women to come test drive its new G35 coupe alongside the z06, ferrari, and porsche. all the women like the g35 better cuz it was cuter and was easier for them to drive. it had way more room for their makeup and purses too!!

those women also said they never drive over 80 mph but every now and then they will have to get to a sale at KOHL'S in a hurry so the little extra performance the G35 has was good. the vette, ferrari, and porshe were just too difficult to drive properly and they said the ludicrous power numbers and 0-60 times of those cars were impractical since you can't go that fast in the local mall traffic anyway.

so by yur theory G35 won performance car of the year over the other 3 cars in the above mentioned test. its didn't perform the best at any of the categories but it will suffice cuz it will fit in with what most people use 2 door coupes for :eyes:

because how something handles while towing is as important to a truck as lipstick compartments on a sports car..

because how something handles while towing is as important to a truck as lipstick compartments on a sports car..
To the right person it is...I think Crazy's arguement is, to writers who don't use a truck on a daily basis or for the limits they are intended they are great trucks. Same thing with sports cars and "certain" women, the Corvettes, Porsches, etc have no bearing on a woman's needs. Like my wife, A car just gets her from place to place, and she likes pretty ones... :jest: That can be everything from a Corvette to a Infinite to Pontiac Solstice.

To the right person it is...I think Crazy's arguement is, to writers who don't use a truck on a daily basis or for the limits they are intended they are great trucks. Same thing with sports cars and "certain" women, the Corvettes, Porsches, etc have no bearing on a woman's needs. Like my wife, A car just gets her from place to place, and she likes pretty ones... :jest: That can be everything from a Corvette to a Infinite to Pontiac Solstice.

Yeah, i understand that but it's like saying that the z06 should of won car of the year because of performance. There are other things that go into that award. The award isn't "best performing truck of the year on paper" it's "truck of the year" which allows it to be very subjective and award what the writers feel is the most innovative or thought out truck, not just who threw a big motor in a 1/2 ton so it towed the most.

Actually, you're contradicting yourself. You're saying it won based on the fact it drove good with 5000lbs load. I would think truck of the year should out perform in every fashion. The Z06 should have won based on the facts that it out performed, outclassed, underpriced all the others, and is much easier/cheaper to own/maintain. Those reasons are GREAT reasons to label it as a better car.

Actually, you're contradicting yourself. You're saying it won based on the fact it drove good with 5000lbs load. I would think truck of the year should out perform in every fashion. The Z06 should have won based on the facts that it out performed, outclassed, underpriced all the others, and is much easier/cheaper to own/maintain. Those reasons are GREAT reasons to label it as a better car.

Remember how general of a title you're talking about. "Car of the year"... yeah, i'm sure a z06 is a great 'car of the year' for a family of 4. The award isn't going to be given to something that performs well in a few areas, it's going to go to something that is either groundbreaking or is just an overall good vehicle. The z06 isn't exactly going to do well in anything outside of performance tests. :jest:

I'm kinda just playing devil's advocate here as i would never own a Ridgeline (currently their towing capacity is about 1,000 pounds light), but i do understand the overall reasoning and some of the innovations made in that truck. I find it humorous how everyone is bashing it and 5-10 years down the road a lot of trucks will have a lot of the features in it, you can quote me on that.

Furthermore, people really should research some before they start bashing stuff. Does anyone know what the 2005 North American Truck of the Year was? Hint, the towing capacity was only 3500 pounds with the biggest motor available. :) Yep, it was the almighty Ford Escape. But yeah, they really dropped the ball naming the Honda truck of the year. :eyes:

I think that only restates the original point that most automagazines have no idea what really is going on.

Basically "<vehicle> of the year" should be awarded based on attributes expected of that sort of vehicle.

Car of the year - quality, reliability, efficiency, comfort.
Peformance car of the year - acceleration, braking, handling, styling.
Truck of the year - towing, hauling, off road/snow/rain handling, cargo capacity.
SUV of the year - off road/snow/rain handling, power, cargo capacity, interior space.

I think you get my point. Unfortunately, almost no organization follows criteria even remotely close to what one would logically expect. Generally criteria includes the following - monetary contributions, advertising deals, perks and kickbacks, and possibility of the reviewer getting winning car for free.

The Honda ridgeline is no more a truck than the Chevy Venture is an SUV. The Chevy is a minivan made to look like an SUV, with a small percentage of the capabilities of an SUV. In the same way, the Ridgeline is a car made to look like a (UGLY) pickup, with a small percentage of the capabilities of a pickup. Honda is kidding itself if it thinks that any person looking for a TRUCK (read: not a wannabe) is going to be persuaded away from Chevy, Ford, Dodge, or Toyota. I can't imagine any real truck owners would even take the Ridgeline seriously enough to take a closer look.

Remember how general of a title you're talking about. "Car of the year"... yeah, i'm sure a z06 is a great 'car of the year' for a family of 4. The award isn't going to be given to something that performs well in a few areas, it's going to go to something that is either groundbreaking or is just an overall good vehicle. The z06 isn't exactly going to do well in anything outside of performance tests. :jest:

I'm kinda just playing devil's advocate here as i would never own a Ridgeline (currently their towing capacity is about 1,000 pounds light), but i do understand the overall reasoning and some of the innovations made in that truck. I find it humorous how everyone is bashing it and 5-10 years down the road a lot of trucks will have a lot of the features in it, you can quote me on that.

Furthermore, people really should research some before they start bashing stuff. Does anyone know what the 2005 North American Truck of the Year was? Hint, the towing capacity was only 3500 pounds with the biggest motor available. :) Yep, it was the almighty Ford Escape. But yeah, they really dropped the ball naming the Honda truck of the year. :eyes:

Yeah you call me when my 3500 HD has a unibody and a 3L V6 with ass-backwards functioning 4wd and then I'll believe you. As for Honda, they blatantly stole their design cues from Chevrolet. It's too bad more Avalanches alone are sold than Ridgelines huh?

Seriously, the Ram should've won the Truck of the Year. It was clearly the best TRUCK there. It outclassed everything they tested, excluding the homo-compatibility rating, which apparantly is all Motor Trend was looking for. I seriously wonder how long that wonderful little V6 and it's transmission/differentials would hold up to a lifetime of towing and heavy duty? Not too well I should think. To put it simply, the Ridgeline is an overpriced wannabe truck. You can get a Silverado Classic with far greater functionality for much less than what you would pay for the Honda, and, as a side benefit, have the massive aftermarket parts sector the GM trucks have. Also, parts are much cheaper and easier to locate for the domestic trucks. While I'm on that one, I would hate to have to work on a Ridgeline. I'll stop ranting now.... so tired...

To be honest I've been around all the new trucks the F150 is the nicest. Its quieter, gets a ton better mpg then our old hemi, and IMO looks the best. Don't get me wrong the dodge is a nice truck as its faster then the F150 but it just doesn't cut it. Drive the new F150 and you will be impressed.

Any Body Ever Seen Consumer Reports On F-bodys!!!

I Think They Gave The Fbody 1 Star Out Of 5 .... Yet This "shitbox" Is Able To Spawn One Of The Largest Online Communties In Existence And Be A Symbol Of Our National Hertige.. Not To Even Mention Any Of The Ass Kicking Attributes Of The Actual Car...

.. I Have Always Agreed The Mags Suck!

Any Body Ever Seen Consumer Reports On F-bodys!!!

I Think They Gave The Fbody 1 Star Out Of 5 .... Yet This "shitbox" Is Able To Spawn One Of The Largest Online Communties In Existence And Be A Symbol Of Our National Hertige.. Not To Even Mention Any Of The Ass Kicking Attributes Of The Actual Car...

As well as (mine at least) being very reliable/dependable, contrary to whatever C.S. says. I always brought this up to the A$$HATS over on bobistheoilguy.com, but of course they never believed me and took C.S.'s opinion verbatum as fact, despite never having owned, driven, an f body, nor even knowing anyone personally who has!! :eyes:

Any Body Ever Seen Consumer Reports On F-bodys!!!

I Think They Gave The Fbody 1 Star Out Of 5 .... Yet This "shitbox" Is Able To Spawn One Of The Largest Online Communties In Existence And Be A Symbol Of Our National Hertige.. Not To Even Mention Any Of The Ass Kicking Attributes Of The Actual Car...

.. I Have Always Agreed The Mags Suck!

First, Consumer Reports is an insult to the paper it's printed on. Second, I don't totally blame one or two-star reviews of the F-body on the publication. It shouldn't be surprising that a body designed in 1992 is not going to fair well against 21st century designs and expectations. That's just that way it goes, and the reason that cars are re-designed. Regardless of the fact that Stock SS's and WS6's can still run with the best modern performance cars out there, they are far behind in terms of chassis and refinement.

I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, God knows I have yet to find a car that is more fun to drive.

I don't care of CD's opinions are on cars they tested as always their results are biased. It's pretty obvious when you read their "comparision" tests as to which vehicle will be classified as the winner. Or worse they compare cars from two different price ranges and basically trash the lower of the two. It's like why bother doing these tests, instead CD should stick to endorsing vehicles as I'm sure they get kickbacks from automotive companies depending on the situation. It's crap like this that put an end to me buying their magazines, and also not to mention Car & Driver is not on Spike TV anymore.

As for Consumer Reports well it pretty obvious there too as to which cars & trucks get their highest approval ratings and the one's that don't.

To be honest I've been around all the new trucks the F150 is the nicest. Its quieter, gets a ton better mpg then our old hemi, and IMO looks the best. Don't get me wrong the dodge is a nice truck as its faster then the F150 but it just doesn't cut it. Drive the new F150 and you will be impressed.

Thanks for reminding me! I completely forgot about the F150... I do like the interiors on the models with leather. I was referring to actual capability in the utility area that should really be one of the most important portions of the test instead of the typical MT or C&D "feel factor". The new Dodges simply outperformed everything in the towing and hauling areas. I laughed when I compared the Dodges numbers under load to the Hondas. Pure comedy gold. IIRC the Dodge stopped FASTER with a trailer.