Automotive News, Media & Press - Road and Track: "evil twins" mag - shocked?

The past couple weeks I have been traveling a lot and bought a ton a magazines to read while on the plane. One of which was this months issue of Road & Track titled "Evil Twins: Street and Track versions of Porsches, vipers, lambos, vettes and ferraris." First off, let me say that they didn't compare actual track results of the vettes or ferraris because they were unavailable for their testing :bang: but they did throw the lambo gallardo spyder vs superleggera; the SRT10 vs SRT10 ACR; Carrera S vs GT3 RS. What shocked me was just from seeing the cover of this magazine I assumed the porsches and lambo's would have the best times (results were done on the Willow Springs racetrack) especially since all the hype I have heard about the GT3's on the track. However, the regular SRT10 bested all the cars tested except the ACR, which beat the other cars considerably. It was my understanding that all german and italian cars bested the viper on the twisties and the track. Hell, Top Gear said that the BMW M class Z4 was equivalent to a viper on the track because the viper handled so bad. So I ask, why do magazines/media consider the viper (and other american cars as well) inferior to the competition when it posted better track times than the competition? In the end, isn't the one with the better track times is the better car? I wish they would have actually tested the ZO6 for a simple comparison too because I am sure it would have ousted the lambo and porsches as well.... someone explain this to me

It is all a taste thing...in the hands of the right driver some of those other cars could have come out better.

W

I beleive it is not only track times that determines car comparison. It a combination of speed, balance, structure, ergonomics, comfort and style. The Viper has speed and presence, it has style and structure but when it comes to interior refinment it takes a back seat to even a corrola. Some care more than others, but to me I guess the new world wants a super computer on wheels that will eventually have a program from tire pressure stability to glove compartment warmer/cooler and beyond. And then there is some of us that enjoy when the tail kicks out and being able to feel all four on the floor.

I beleive it is not only track times that determines car comparison. It a combination of speed, balance, structure, ergonomics, comfort and style. The Viper has speed and presence, it has style and structure but when it comes to interior refinment it takes a back seat to even a corrola. Some care more than others, but to me I guess the new world wants a super computer on wheels that will eventually have a program from tire pressure stability to glove compartment warmer/cooler and beyond. And then there is some of us that enjoy when the tail kicks out and being able to feel all four on the floor.

I agree, I just find it interesting that most media groups consider the european sports cars so far ahead of american cars yet they aren't beating them on the track. Like when you hear the lines of our american cars are so outdated with leaf springs and pushrod engines yet they can still beat a euro car, double the sticker price, on the track. It just seems they don't give much respect to american cars. I agree that the Viper has a strictly racing cockpit and no refinements but it still beats a lambo and track ready GT3 around the track.

and your right WECIV, those cars could do better but then again maybe the viper could have too. I would think the lambo, especially, with all wheel drive would be more user friendly and the driver of the viper needs to be a lot more aggressive

The reason the Euro boys hate the Viper is not because it is unrefined(look at their beloved TVR's and Nobles...), but because to get the track times that beat the world in a Viper, you have to scare the living piss out of yourself and take the car to the danger zone. That danger zone starts whenever you turn the damn key.

I honestly don't get how they can seriously dog the Vipers and then turn around and praise a fucking speed 6 or Tamora... Or better yet, a Caterham of all goddamn things...:bang:

Amen to that one Hydramatic.


The most insane, and by insane I mean deranged "let me see how quick I can get to just inside the bounds of out-of-control" folks will mercilessly flog a car that swiftly kill you. Examples that come to mind: Track rat viper, track rat vette, Carrera GT, or any 2WD heavily boosted Porsche. If it has all the goody bits to post scorching times but is likely to send you way the hell out of control for miscuing, then it's typically frowned upon by the latte Euro or sake JDM crowd.

Just so happens that while those drivers flog their cars to the outer bounds, they demonstrate the skill required to tame such beasts.

How many people can tame an Evo or STi or Miata? Doesn't require much of a brain.

How many can say the same about any of the track monsters I listed? Not near as many.


There comes a time where purpose meets performance.

considering that these guys who test drive these cars don't own american cars, that would be like me going to test drive the gt-r and the new ZR1 it would be hard for me to have anything good to say about the gt-r but i would be praising the ZR1 cause i'm a GM man.

Amen to that one Hydramatic.


The most insane, and by insane I mean deranged "let me see how quick I can get to just inside the bounds of out-of-control" folks will mercilessly flog a car that swiftly kill you. Examples that come to mind: Track rat viper, track rat vette, Carrera GT, or any 2WD heavily boosted Porsche. If it has all the goody bits to post scorching times but is likely to send you way the hell out of control for miscuing, then it's typically frowned upon by the latte Euro or sake JDM crowd.

Just so happens that while those drivers flog their cars to the outer bounds, they demonstrate the skill required to tame such beasts.

How many people can tame an Evo or STi or Miata? Doesn't require much of a brain.

How many can say the same about any of the track monsters I listed? Not near as many.


There comes a time where purpose meets performance.I think this about sums it up. This is the reason the New GT-R is so popular with journalists right now. Anyone can put up big numbers due to the electrical nannies holding your hand and cupping your balls while you ring it out.

The C6 Z06 with an experienced driver equaled the GT-R on the Ring. But journalists are about 3-4 seconds slower in the Z06 than the Gt-R due to the above. Therefore to them it is a better car than the Viper or Z06. I think it is complete bullshit but thats why most Mags and TV shows are fucking jokes to me.

They take away the driver and praise a car that does everything for you. Just mash the gas and turn the wheel and the car does the rest is not my cup of tea. If your not on the ragged edge it takes away the whole point and visceral experience of a Sports/GT/Muscle car IMO.

I think this about sums it up. This is the reason the New GT-R is so popular with journalists right now. Anyone can put up big numbers due to the electrical nannies holding your hand and cupping your balls while you ring it out.

The C6 Z06 with an experienced driver equaled the GT-R on the Ring. But journalists are about 3-4 seconds slower in the Z06 than the Gt-R due to the above. Therefore to them it is a better car than the Viper or Z06. I think it is complete bullshit but thats why most Mags and TV shows are fucking jokes to me.

They take away the driver and praise a car that does everything for you. Just mash the gas and turn the wheel and the car does the rest is not my cup of tea. If your not on the ragged edge it takes away the whole point and visceral experience of a Sports/GT/Muscle car IMO.

And that's what is so disappointing to me about the GTR.... The old Skyline GT-R was a pretty scary ride when you pushed it to the limits...this GTR was designed from the start to be easy for noobie drivers...