I am stumped at this point. I have a 00 Trans Am, stock clutch with 93K miles that started losing it's pedal at the end of the 1/4 and would be extremely weak but the pedal would come back. I was told that it was the clutch so I got a used Ram twin disk, aluminum flywheel, new ram master cylinder and new slave cylinder. I installed in all with out taking a measurement for the gap because I never heard of shimming the slave before.
After installing everything the car is hard to shift into any gear upon start up and impossible to go into reverse. If I key it up without starting it goes into each gear and reverse fine. If I drive it I have to force it into each gear harder than normal but after driving it a little ways I can shift into reverse. I though that it could be the fluid so I re-bled the system and put in DOT 4. Still have the issue and then came across this thread and I figured that it may need shimmed because when the car is stopped and in the process of putting it into 1st gear, the car will start to roll forward, start to put it into reverse and the car will roll backwards. It seems like the slave is not not fully disengaging the clutch.
I took the trans back out to measure for a shim and I get a negative number. the clutch measures 1.85 and the slave/trans measures 1.98. The clutch disks were thick and seemed to have plenty of life left so what could be causing the issue, any ideas?
I had a stage 3 with no shim for 5 years no problem with clutch. I installed a SPEC stage 2+ this weekend, new slave, new flywheel. I measured both "a" and "b" had 1/16th diff. So I opted not to put in the shim. Now my pedal is near the floor after bleeding the system. It is hard shifting and will not go in reverse. If you start the car in gear it will creep forward, obviously the clutch is not fully disengaging. I will pull it this week and put in the shim. Even when measureing you may still need to shim. If you are having problems getting the car in gear, after you have bled the clutch you may have to shim it for proper engagement even if your measurements were in tolerance.
I had a stage 3 with no shim for 5 years no problem with clutch. I installed a SPEC stage 2+ this weekend, new slave, new flywheel. I measured both "a" and "b" had 1/16th diff. So I opted not to put in the shim. Now my pedal is near the floor after bleeding the system. It is hard shifting and will not go in reverse. If you start the car in gear it will creep forward, obviously the clutch is not fully disengaging. I will pull it this week and put in the shim. Even when measureing you may still need to shim. If you are having problems getting the car in gear, after you have bled the clutch you may have to shim it for proper engagement even if your measurements were in tolerance.
I have a Textralia clutch and it came with a brand new slave/TO bearing assembly. My gap comes out to 5/16" (.313) which is more than either Tick or Ram recommends. With my old (extremely worn out) T/O assy. and the new clutch, the gap is only 1/8" (.125) which is supposed to be ok. In comparing the two T/O assys. without the springs in them, the new one compresses all the way in until the plastic retainer piece contacts the base of the assy. while the old one stops about 3/16" from hitting. Does this sound right? Is there something wrong with the new T/O assy.? If this sounds normal, where do I get shims from? Thanks.
does anybody have the instructions for the ram dual disc for a ls1 fbody from ram? just tried to call they r only 45 mins from me but there tech is closed for 2day
If the measurement on "B" is greater then "A" it will keep slight preasure on the fingers of the presure plate the hole time....
correct?
Correct
I have read this whole thread through now & I'm glad you guys made it a sticky for guys like me to find. I totally understand the shiming (if required) measurements. I have been all over the Aussie LS1 forums asking these question but so far nobody has answered me. Even with the various aftermarket clutch sponsors on those sites .
I'm in the middle of making up a Twin Disc clutch kit to fit a T56 M12 up behind a Supercharged 3800 GMH V6. Presently nobody made a flywheel to do this so a custom one has been made now. Some measurement & info has been very hard to obtain, even from the clutch manufacturers (Clutch Industries Australia).
A few questions I have you may be able to answer.
First question(s):
On the T56 with CSC TOB in say your 2004 GTO (our monaro ), how far will the CSC move out with one full depression of the clutch pedal, assuming a correctly bled system ?
Example: if the CSC is preloaded back 5/8" from rest postion (uninstalled unit), will it extend forward the full 5/8" with one full depression of the clutch pedal. Or will it only move out say 7/16" dependant on master cylinder volume/per stroke ?
Second question(s):
Do all clutch pressure plates need the same amount of diaphragm finger deflection to release the plate(s) fully, like 3/8" or 1/2" ?
Can the diaphragm fingers be over deflected if the setting up of the slave is wrong, causing some sort of damage to the pressure plate ?
Thanks for your help.
Cheers
Deek
Last edited by OZ38; 10-02-2009 at 02:07 PM..
Reason: spelling errors
I have read this whole thread through now & I'm glad you guys made it a sticky for guys like me to find. I totally understand the shiming (if required) measurements. I have been all over the Aussie LS1 forums asking these question but so far nobody has answered me. Even with the various aftermarket clutch sponsors on those sites .
I'm in the middle of making up a Twin Disc clutch kit to fit a T56 M12 up behind a Supercharged 3800 GMH V6. Presently nobody made a flywheel to do this so a custom one has been made now. Some measurement & info has been very hard to obtain, even from the clutch manufacturers (Clutch Industries Australia).
A few questions I have you may be able to answer.
First question(s):
On the T56 with CSC TOB in say your 2004 GTO (our monaro ), how far will the CSC move out with one full depression of the clutch pedal, assuming a correctly bled system ?
Example: if the CSC is preloaded back 5/8" from rest postion (uninstalled unit), will it extend forward the full 5/8" with one full depression of the clutch pedal. Or will it only move out say 7/16" dependant on master cylinder volume/per stroke ?
Second question(s):
Do all clutch pressure plates need the same amount of diaphragm finger deflection to release the plate(s) fully, like 3/8" or 1/2" ?
Can the diaphragm fingers be over deflected if the setting up of the slave is wrong, causing some sort of damage to the pressure plate ?
I installed a Spec 3+ in my 2001 Corvette and was unaware of the possible need for a shim. So, i didn t measure it when it was apart. Everything works Great so far!
On the T56 with CSC TOB in say your 2004 GTO (our monaro ), how far will the CSC move out with one full depression of the clutch pedal, assuming a correctly bled system ?
Example: if the CSC is preloaded back 5/8" from rest postion (uninstalled unit), will it extend forward the full 5/8" with one full depression of the clutch pedal. Or will it only move out say 7/16" dependant on master cylinder volume/per stroke ?
Second question(s):
Do all clutch pressure plates need the same amount of diaphragm finger deflection to release the plate(s) fully, like 3/8" or 1/2" ?
Can the diaphragm fingers be over deflected if the setting up of the slave is wrong, causing some sort of damage to the pressure plate ?
Thanks for your help.
Cheers
Deek
First of all, you should have started your own thread on this topic. People come here to read up on a shim, not to answer questions that are
Not being an ass my friend, just telling you that is why you have not been helped yet.
PM coming, so as not to
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It all makes sense to me today about measuring etc. but now i've got conflicting measurements.
According to Tick the gap should be .0625-.125 & RAM says .175-.225 gap..... I've got a Spec 3+ what gap should i shoot for?
__________________ "02 Electron Blue C5 Corvette"
Sitting on bench ready to go on this winter
TEA 5.3L heads 1.5 porting 2.02/1.55, SI6 cam, Harland Sharp roller rockers, FAST 92/LS2 90 TB, Spec 3+ & Yella Terra ULW flywheel, DTE strut rearend brace, & lots of other Speed inc & SLP stuff.
more problems..... i just measured all my stuff and its -.220" in other words I have no gap and if i bolted everything together the TOB would push in the fingers .220" before i even touched the pedal........... this is stupid. i miss automatics right now. HELP!!!!!!
__________________ "02 Electron Blue C5 Corvette"
Sitting on bench ready to go on this winter
TEA 5.3L heads 1.5 porting 2.02/1.55, SI6 cam, Harland Sharp roller rockers, FAST 92/LS2 90 TB, Spec 3+ & Yella Terra ULW flywheel, DTE strut rearend brace, & lots of other Speed inc & SLP stuff.
Ok new news, i figured out that the slave cylinder wasn't retracted all the way but now it is 100% and its still no gap or very little best case.
Distance "A" from fingers to bell housing flange is average of 2.328"
Distance "B" from bearing surface of TOB to flange of torque tube average is 2.355"
= -.027 gap (negative gap)
I can't figure out whats wrong? I've triple checked everything and its all right.
Only thing i can think of is I bought a new lightweight Yella Terra steel flywheel and could the offset from the surface area where the bolt holes are to the flywheel surface be machined wrong? that would throw that number into a negative really easy if it was......
__________________ "02 Electron Blue C5 Corvette"
Sitting on bench ready to go on this winter
TEA 5.3L heads 1.5 porting 2.02/1.55, SI6 cam, Harland Sharp roller rockers, FAST 92/LS2 90 TB, Spec 3+ & Yella Terra ULW flywheel, DTE strut rearend brace, & lots of other Speed inc & SLP stuff.
Ok new news, i figured out that the slave cylinder wasn't retracted all the way but now it is 100% and its still no gap or very little best case.
Distance "A" from fingers to bell housing flange is average of 2.328"
Distance "B" from bearing surface of TOB to flange of torque tube average is 2.355"
= -.027 gap (negative gap)
I can't figure out whats wrong? I've triple checked everything and its all right.
Only thing i can think of is I bought a new lightweight Yella Terra steel flywheel and could the offset from the surface area where the bolt holes are to the flywheel surface be machined wrong? that would throw that number into a negative really easy if it was......
I think Tick vs Rams measurements have to do with the differences in slave cylinders. Not all are created equal. When retracted some slaves are longer or deeper than others.
.
), how far will the CSC move out with one full depression of the clutch pedal, assuming a correctly bled system ?
