I feel the biggest problem running a T56 in high hp cars is the lack on lubrication on the head set gear and front gear on the counter shaft. After tearing up 2 G-Force gears I studied the gears closely and discovered that the gears were messed up because of lack of lubrication. Under hard acceleration where does the fluid go?....yes to the rear of the tranny, leaving the head set gear dry and that gear is supplying load through the counter shaft in every gear except 4th gear.
I decided that I wanted to rig up a pump so that I was always spraying fluid on the head set gear. I looked around and found a 12 volt electric gear pump and so far so good. I just got finished taking my tranny apart to inspect it and the head set gear and front counter shaft gear still look brand new.
__________________ John
2000 SS Camaro 6-speed
LSX 427 with F1A - 940 rwhp, 809 rwtq on 15 lbs
9.78 @ 150.52 with a M6 @ 3900 lbs race weight on 16.5 lbs.
In a situation like yours where the car is probably face plated and a pure race car , I would play with fluids instead of worrying about spraying it on the gears like you have done .
I would think a full synthetic race fluid like the stuff Synergen offers would cling to the gears for a long enough period until the car came down and the fluid leveled off .
Location: windsor, ont. canada - Home of the fastest LT1 6spd.
Posts: 2,979
Quote:
Originally Posted by speedracer5532
I feel the biggest problem running a T56 in high hp cars is the lack on lubrication on the head set gear and front gear on the counter shaft. After tearing up 2 G-Force gears I studied the gears closely and discovered that the gears were messed up because of lack of lubrication. Under hard acceleration where does the fluid go?....yes to the rear of the tranny, leaving the head set gear dry and that gear is supplying load through the counter shaft in every gear except 4th gear.
I decided that I wanted to rig up a pump so that I was always spraying fluid on the head set gear. I looked around and found a 12 volt electric gear pump and so far so good. I just got finished taking my tranny apart to inspect it and the head set gear and front counter shaft gear still look brand new.
correct! i added a pump filter and cooler 2 years ago. it is money well spent!
as well, i believe that a year or 2 ago tremec added a pump to the t56 transmissions to send fluid up to the front where the trans is being starved of lubrication on hard launches, just what i heard. i turn my pump on when i run the car, otherwise it is left off, no need for it tio be turned on when driving the car on the street. i too have seen the same type of problems in the past.
__________________ 1996 SS 399 ci LT1 Harshaw Race Engine, Full BMR suspension. Best 60' 1.27/MPH 155.28 Quickest & Fastest TRUE T56 F body
First LT1 6spd f-Body in the 8's & 9's. N2O:8.97@ 155.23,1.34 60'/3600lbs.
Thanks to: Liberty's Gears, BMR Fabrication, Bryan Harshaw - HRE, McLeod Ind., FAST, Madman, Applied Nitrous Technology, and Eric Bradby ~ EB Porting.
In a situation like yours where the car is probably face plated and a pure race car , I would play with fluids instead of worrying about spraying it on the gears like you have done .
I would think a full synthetic race fluid like the stuff Synergen offers would cling to the gears for a long enough period until the car came down and the fluid leveled off .
I have a normal synchroed G-Force T56 and my car is 90% street car and 10% drag car. Racing liter motorcycles from 50-150 is hard on that head set gear. I have ran my tranny with 100% of the G-Force fluid and that didn't help. Spraying the gear has been the answer.
__________________ John
2000 SS Camaro 6-speed
LSX 427 with F1A - 940 rwhp, 809 rwtq on 15 lbs
9.78 @ 150.52 with a M6 @ 3900 lbs race weight on 16.5 lbs.
correct! i added a pump filter and cooler 2 years ago. it is money well spent!
as well, i believe that a year or 2 ago tremec added a pump to the t56 transmissions to send fluid up to the front where the trans is being starved of lubrication on hard launches, just what i heard. i turn my pump on when i run the car, otherwise it is left off, no need for it to be turned on when driving the car on the street. i too have seen the same type of problems in the past.
I just run my pump all the time. That is why I wanted a gear pump instead of a diaphragm pump because I felt diaphragm pump would wear out much sooner than a gear pump.
__________________ John
2000 SS Camaro 6-speed
LSX 427 with F1A - 940 rwhp, 809 rwtq on 15 lbs
9.78 @ 150.52 with a M6 @ 3900 lbs race weight on 16.5 lbs.
correct! i added a pump filter and cooler 2 years ago. it is money well spent!
as well, i believe that a year or 2 ago tremec added a pump to the t56 transmissions to send fluid up to the front where the trans is being starved of lubrication on hard launches, just what i heard. i turn my pump on when i run the car, otherwise it is left off, no need for it tio be turned on when driving the car on the street. i too have seen the same type of problems in the past.
The OEM pumps on the LS7 and late model T56s just circulate
the fluid for consistent temps, no spray bar, just dumps the
cooled fluid back to the top side of the case, right where the
alignment bolts are.
Location: windsor, ont. canada - Home of the fastest LT1 6spd.
Posts: 2,979
Quote:
Originally Posted by 85MikeTPI
The OEM pumps on the LS7 and late model T56s just circulate
the fluid for consistent temps, no spray bar, just dumps the
cooled fluid back to the top side of the case, right where the
alignment bolts are.
ok, thanks mike, i was just stating what i had heard. my assumption was that they would be spraying oil at 4th gear where it needs it. i have had to swap 4th gear out due to heat, caused by lack of fluid. that was the main reason i added the pump. i had heard of road course guys doing it, which makes perfect sense.
i installed a weldon pump to handle circulation, i even had Kinsler flow it, and turn up the pressure to be on the safe side.
__________________ 1996 SS 399 ci LT1 Harshaw Race Engine, Full BMR suspension. Best 60' 1.27/MPH 155.28 Quickest & Fastest TRUE T56 F body
First LT1 6spd f-Body in the 8's & 9's. N2O:8.97@ 155.23,1.34 60'/3600lbs.
Thanks to: Liberty's Gears, BMR Fabrication, Bryan Harshaw - HRE, McLeod Ind., FAST, Madman, Applied Nitrous Technology, and Eric Bradby ~ EB Porting.
Location: windsor, ont. canada - Home of the fastest LT1 6spd.
Posts: 2,979
slowhawk,
that is a great idea, i mean i have the fast turning all sorts of shit at WOT, lol!!! i am pretty sure I still have one more output I can utilize.
__________________ 1996 SS 399 ci LT1 Harshaw Race Engine, Full BMR suspension. Best 60' 1.27/MPH 155.28 Quickest & Fastest TRUE T56 F body
First LT1 6spd f-Body in the 8's & 9's. N2O:8.97@ 155.23,1.34 60'/3600lbs.
Thanks to: Liberty's Gears, BMR Fabrication, Bryan Harshaw - HRE, McLeod Ind., FAST, Madman, Applied Nitrous Technology, and Eric Bradby ~ EB Porting.
If you overfill, you risk airating the fluid and causing friction damage. If you do overfill, you need to make sure you add anti-foaming agents that don't change the ATF friction/lubrication properties..
Location: windsor, ont. canada - Home of the fastest LT1 6spd.
Posts: 2,979
redline atf d4 is good fluid, as well as synergyn fluids. that is about the only reliable product i purchased from G Force, lmmfao! hey i just made a funny. i figure it is a good product as it is puchased from a good vendor.
__________________ 1996 SS 399 ci LT1 Harshaw Race Engine, Full BMR suspension. Best 60' 1.27/MPH 155.28 Quickest & Fastest TRUE T56 F body
First LT1 6spd f-Body in the 8's & 9's. N2O:8.97@ 155.23,1.34 60'/3600lbs.
Thanks to: Liberty's Gears, BMR Fabrication, Bryan Harshaw - HRE, McLeod Ind., FAST, Madman, Applied Nitrous Technology, and Eric Bradby ~ EB Porting.
redline atf d4 is good fluid, as well as synergyn fluids. that is about the only reliable product i purchased from G Force, lmmfao! hey i just made a funny. i figure it is a good product as it is puchased from a good vendor.
hey Taner. liberty told me to use syncromesh with the faceplate. Have you found something better?
Looking good. what clutch and internals are you guys using? I only intend to make 700whp so i'm not nearly stressing the car as much as some of you guys
__________________ 1999 Trans Am
Stock Daily Driver 1989 Iroc-Z L98
401" Dart block, AFR 195cc, Jones 233/233 112lsa
Twin 60mm turbos, Victor EFI single plane
TH400, PTC converter, 10 bolt 2.73 gear
9.86 at 141 1.56 60' 14psi street tune pump gas
I am running a Spec twin disk and I have a G-force T-56.
__________________ John
2000 SS Camaro 6-speed
LSX 427 with F1A - 940 rwhp, 809 rwtq on 15 lbs
9.78 @ 150.52 with a M6 @ 3900 lbs race weight on 16.5 lbs.
I see you have a McLeod Blowproof bellhousing. Did you check the bellhousing alignment when you installed it? The McLeod Blowproof housing is notorious for it's bad alignment, particularly concentricity. If the input shaft is poorly aligned, the headset gears would not run parallel to each other and may become damaged from missalignment. Just a thought.
__________________ John
2000 SS Camaro 6-speed
LSX 427 with F1A - 940 rwhp, 809 rwtq on 15 lbs
9.78 @ 150.52 with a M6 @ 3900 lbs race weight on 16.5 lbs.
The McLeod Blowproof housing is notorious for it's bad alignment, particularly concentricity.
This is simply not true. The installation of this bell REQUIRES the alignment of the bell to the engine pilot bearing as a basic step. You cannot just bolt it up & go. Anyone with alignment problems simply did not follow instructions.
How to make T56 hold up in high HP cars. 
