No, it's an additive. You can use it in your fuel tank, oil, crankcase and in your meth. kit. ect. A friend of mine uses it in his 87 Grand National meth. kit. He said that when he bought the kit that they told him to put that in with his meth. Just for that reason. I contacted MMO to confrim that and they also said yes to it. That it has many different uses. My friend has been running it with his meth kit now for a long time. I didn't even know that he used it. Until I was asking questions about it.
One thing about adding oil based products is that they reduce the octane, isn't this correct?
-Will
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Problem with that stuff, is it could cause a similar situation as oil blow by.. oil blow by and any substantial amount of nitrous is bad news. One reason it's a really good idea for a vaccum pump and a heavy oil on a motor seeing alot of nitrous, to help keep the oil under control and out of the cyl's
ok, so whats the percentage of "lubricant" in gasoline. sounds like it would be safe to assume that, that is a reasonable amount to add to the meth. does this sound stupid, cuz then it would be no different the spraying gasoline in there, except it would be an alcohol based mixture instead.
im sure it could be done,, why not.. seams beter,, i have heqard of people doing it with 110 octane... ive thought about the meth with n20 too. and even thought about n20 with nitro.. that would be a scary ideal..
Gasoline, being oil based is actually a good lubricant, compared to methanol, which has no oil base at all.
You also wrote this. Nitrous and alcohol work VERY well, but again, getting a handle on the tuneup is alot harder, because the plugs are alot harder to read. Alcohol burns alot colder too, so you can get away with alot more as well, but, thebad part is alcohol is a solvent, and you can wash the rings out of a motor really easy with it, then get oil in the combustion chambers, and once that happens nitrous + alcohol + oil is a bad bad combo. You'll hurt alot of parts with that for sure.If you don't mind re-ringing a motor quite often, an alcohol/nitrous motor will for sure make big steam, but plan on alot more maintenance like re-ringing, and putting new bearings in too while you have it apart.
Is that not the point? You don't add a lot of the MMO just a few cap fulls of it. to the methanol.
I've been wondering about this too. With a forged bottom possibly going in this winter, I was thinking of going to a Speed Density tune, and spraying a mix of meth and nitrous through the turbo.
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I've been wondering about this too. With a forged bottom possibly going in this winter, I was thinking of going to a Speed Density tune, and spraying a mix of meth and nitrous through the turbo.
With the research that I have been doing with this type of setup. Direct port nitrous is the best setup. And the meth. should come after the IC. It is also my understanding that you dont want to go with a big shot of nitrous. For with FAI motors a 100hp shot would = close to a 200 shot. But dont quote me on that.
What kind of fuel set up to you have? It has also be told to me that you will want to have a bigger fuel rail and fuel line for more vol. with 2 pumps in the tank and 80 pound injectors. Then have it dyno tuned for the set up.
I would like to know what everyone on here thinks of this info. and just how big of a shot you could run with this set up with 9.1 CR. and how much boost!?
I have 44#'s and a Walbro with boost referancing regulator. I think a 75 shot+ more meth would be plenty to keep the IAT's very low. I was thinking about a stand alone meth system just to feed the nitrous Y block pre turbo, and keep the system I have spraying across the IAT sensor. (2 seperate systems)
__________________ 01 Trans Am, STS turbo, STS methanol injection, STS Boost Controller, ASP pulley, 3" Cat back to turbo, ported and polished MAF & TB, Optima red top, overdrive alternator pulley, tuned by Nelson Performance 425hp, 446tq 4psi Dyno jet.
Black w/ white "skunk" stripes Verde Custom 17x9 front & 17x10.5 rear Bullett's wearing 315/35R17 BFG G-Force T/A Drag Radials www.wvstreets.com
The thing that bothers me about the MMO going into the combustion chamber is:
Oil in the combustion chamber with nitrous (faulty pcv setup tracking alot of oil back into the intake) tends to make the cylinder temps higher. Thus, a detonation prone situation.
Kinda seems like a double standard
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The thing that bothers me about the MMO going into the combustion chamber is:
Oil in the combustion chamber with nitrous (faulty pcv setup tracking alot of oil back into the intake) tends to make the cylinder temps higher. Thus, a detonation prone situation.
Kinda seems like a double standard
Like I've said before, he has been running this set up for a long time now and hes not had any problems as of now. I don't think that the the place he got it from would tell him to use it if they was a problem with doing so.
Like I said also you don't put that much in the mix. They are some guys with LS1 running the same set up and they have not had any problems. But what do I know I am still in the research stage of it all. I can only relay what I've seen and what I was told.
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Talk to any of the expert nitrous guys in the country, and ask them what oil in the combustion chamber does when you're running nitrous. Yes gasoline and race fuel are oil based, but it's not the same as adding an actual oil to the fuel.
Make a couple phone calls to a couple big nitrous tuners and ask them, see what you get for info.
what about using e-85? would that be a good way to get the benefits of both fuels? get the colder temps, higher octane, and more power from the alcohol, but still keep a little bit of gasoline for the lubrication and what not? and if you were to run e-85, how much would you have to up the fuel jet?
Talk to any of the expert nitrous guys in the country, and ask them what oil in the combustion chamber does when you're running nitrous. Yes gasoline and race fuel are oil based, but it's not the same as adding an actual oil to the fuel.
Make a couple phone calls to a couple big nitrous tuners and ask them, see what you get for info.
Ok I'm going to break it down for you and no not the motor! The MMO is not the type of oil that you may be thinking about. The amount that one would put in the meth. would just be enough to keep it safe from a build up to take place. So it will burn safe a long with the meth. while keeping the rings with in the normal limits. So your not replacing the rings more than one should.
I understand what you're saying and yes if you over did the mix this probably would happen over time. But if you dont then no. But is up to that one person to make sure not to over do the mix
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mitch cobb racing
what about using e-85? would that be a good way to get the benefits of both fuels? get the colder temps, higher octane, and more power from the alcohol, but still keep a little bit of gasoline for the lubrication and what not? and if you were to run e-85, how much would you have to up the fuel jet?
Fuel jet would have to be increased probably 15%, whatever that works out to.
Honestly, I don't even look at E85 as a viable fuel, being that you can't even get it in CT where I am anywhere that I have seen....
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Quote:
Originally Posted by craig382ci
Ok I'm going to break it down for you and no not the motor! The MMO is not the type of oil that you may be thinking about. The amount that one would put in the meth. would just be enough to keep it safe from a build up to take place. So it will burn safe a long with the meth. while keeping the rings with in the normal limits. So your not replacing the rings more than one should.
I understand what you're saying and yes if you over did the mix this probably would happen over time. But if you dont then no. But is up to that one person to make sure not to over do the mix
I'll put this another way, if you are trying to use methanol as a fuel for a nitrous car, the only time that it would be worth while would be in a full blown race application where the motor is coming apart every 20 passes anyway, in that case the ring life is not the concern that it would be in a street application.
For a street car it's not worth the added headache. Most people don't even want to bother with a standalone, they want to just run pump fuel for the whole car and only have to fill one tank and be done with it.
Methanol, as a fuel for a nitrous setup would be a good choice if you are looking to try to make say 1300 hp, if you're goal is less then that there's plenty of race fuel available that will do the job (some like C23 that will be good for way more then 1300) and not have the headaches.
I'll put this another way, if you are trying to use methanol as a fuel for a nitrous car, the only time that it would be worth while would be in a full blown race application where the motor is coming apart every 20 passes anyway, in that case the ring life is not the concern that it would be in a street application.
For a street car it's not worth the added headache. Most people don't even want to bother with a standalone, they want to just run pump fuel for the whole car and only have to fill one tank and be done with it.
Methanol, as a fuel for a nitrous setup would be a good choice if you are looking to try to make say 1300 hp, if you're goal is less then that there's plenty of race fuel available that will do the job (some like C23 that will be good for way more then 1300) and not have the headaches.
Yes that was understood. I was talking about using 2 kits one being the meth. and the other being the nitrous. With someone else. I am with you on setting one up like that. It would have to be a full blown race car before I would set it up that way.
But if you set one up with the 2 kits like the people I was talking about with a turbo or a blower. The 2 kit set up is the way to go. That I've seen of anyway! With the right fuel setup to support it and a good tune.
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More stuff you put in a car, the more problems you can end up with, that's what I have seen.
If you want good reliable power, keep it simple. Hell I know of people in the area running around with 390ish inch smallblock's and a single turbo that can't keep the tires on the car on any road, with pump 93 octane. You can only put so much to the ground, anything more then 700 rwhp on the street is 100% useless, hell even 600 rw is pretty useless 90% of the time.
My sled only makes 450 rwhp and when I had it on the street with the n/a converter it would blow the tires off with a whack of the throttle at anything less then highway speed, with the nitrous on forget it
