tuning for nitrous basics

FiFdYnUtz · 10-20-2009, 11:39 PM

so im looking to hook up a dual nozzle wet kit to my car this winter and spray 100-150...

my question is, since my tuner is uber busy anymore and doesnt have time to help me with a nitrous tune, what are the basic steps of what needs to be done? i have a wideband and gauge and hptuners and already have tr6's and all the safety equipment...

how much timing, what do i need to adjust, what do i need to watch, just basically, what needs to be done to set up a solid and SAFE nitrous tune on my car? i have basic tuning experience but nothing crazy and my car is tuned in speed density...any help is appreciated, thanks!!

custm2500 · 10-20-2009, 11:49 PM

Safe is 2 degrees of timing for each 50. I am a strong believer in 1 per 50. So 3 degrees would get you into a 150 shot with out problem. I am sure tuners can offer more but that is a start. I know you best bet will be to start fat and bring it back some over a few runs till you hit the sweet spot.

SuperSlow02 · 10-21-2009, 01:29 AM

6 degrees pulled, and since its a wet shot, basically just watch your AFR and monitor for spark knock...add or pull timing as needed. Pretty much the basics

camscam02 · 10-21-2009, 03:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by custm2500

Safe is 2 degrees of timing for each 50. I am a strong believer in 1 per 50. So 3 degrees would get you into a 150 shot with out problem. I am sure tuners can offer more but that is a start. I know you best bet will be to start fat and bring it back some over a few runs till you hit the sweet spot.

those are bad suggestions. Nothing is SAFE...

custm2500 · 10-21-2009, 08:05 AM

What do you mean nothing is safe? Are you anti nitrous? Nitrous is VERY safe and minimal changes need to be made to run it. A special nitrous tune is mostly to get every extra hp per drop of nitrous. So I don't understand your comment.

camscam02 · 10-21-2009, 12:37 PM

it means that just because it is safe on your combo telling some guy over the internet to do this and this and it will be safe is not the right way to go about things. 1 per 50 is also not gonna work, we pull 8 on a 150 and our timing marks look great on our plugs right now, if I were to only pull 3, my motor would not be happy.

The only correct way to tune is to pull plugs and not guess. sure you might get away with guessing timing and afr and be in the ballpark but you can also miss big time.

FiFdYnUtz · 10-21-2009, 02:29 PM

so at the moment i am running 25* because hke told me to take it there, supposedly the ls motors like it better....if i were to start out pulling 8 degrees and work my way back until it knocks and then adjust from there, would that be the proper procedure? and how do i read my plugs for nitrous? thanks for the help so far guys!

JAX04 · 10-21-2009, 03:45 PM

Youll run your car on the spray, then immediately shut it down. i mean immediatley. you dont want to change the plugs. then pull a couple and read away. its the same process as any other plug reading process for a gas motor. looking for the heat range on the strap, the a/f on the upper ring and checking the porcelein for any signs of detonation. etc. etc. there is a great read up on here somewhere, ill see if i can find it.

LOL, i found a video of the same read up that i use.

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/267712...d_spark_plugs/

FiFdYnUtz · 10-21-2009, 04:00 PM

k sweet, i'll look for it too..thanks!

FiFdYnUtz · 10-21-2009, 04:26 PM

awesome thanks!

FiFdYnUtz · 10-21-2009, 04:35 PM

so what i have gathered is i will make some runs, check for knock retard and set up my timing retard so that i have 0 KR, next i will make some runs spraying and check my AFR/plugs and just adjust fuel/nitrous jets accordingly until i am spraying at a good safe AFR and my plugs are looking good...eh? i dont need to make any adjustments to my base tune with hptuners?

slammin86 · 10-21-2009, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FiFdYnUtz

so what i have gathered is i will make some runs, check for knock retard and set up my timing retard so that i have 0 KR, next i will make some runs spraying and check my AFR/plugs and just adjust fuel/nitrous jets accordingly until i am spraying at a good safe AFR and my plugs are looking good...eh? i dont need to make any adjustments to my base tune with hptuners?

What is your current peak timing at wot?

FiFdYnUtz · 10-21-2009, 06:08 PM

i run 25-27* generally..

273sunsetZ · 10-21-2009, 06:15 PM

i run 28* and pulled 9* using the resistor mod on the 150 hit and ran 10.6 @ 130... I'd start by pulling 8* and work your way down. as long as your a/f is on the safe side and your not experiencing any knock you will be fine. for instance, mine is 10.9 afr and don't plan on adj. it. its on the safe side which is fine with me.

rm2500 · 10-21-2009, 06:22 PM

i just blew a ringland last week because my 250 shot had a rich condition
and back fired so hard it blew my muffler apart so i would get it around 11.7-11.9 and check your plugs on the dyno

FiFdYnUtz · 10-21-2009, 07:06 PM

well my cars afr NA is in the low 12's i believe, i need to richen it more when i spray?

273sunsetZ · 10-21-2009, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rm2500

i just blew a ringland last week because my 250 shot had a rich condition
and back fired so hard it blew my muffler apart so i would get it around 11.7-11.9 and check your plugs on the dyno

wow... how rich are we talking?

G Engines · 10-21-2009, 08:51 PM

I tune a promod on 4 systems the last time out we ran 4.14 @ 178 mph to the 1/8 and i shoot for 12 to 12.2 any richer it lifts rings any leaner it burns pistons, but every engine is different.

camscam02 · 10-21-2009, 08:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 273sunsetZ

i run 28* and pulled 9* using the resistor mod on the 150 hit and ran 10.6 @ 130... I'd start by pulling 8* and work your way down. as long as your a/f is on the safe side and your not experiencing any knock you will be fine. for instance, mine is 10.9 afr and don't plan on adj. it. its on the safe side which is fine with me.

widebands can do weird things. have you ever looked at your plugs to see exactly how rich it is?

Id def. take some fuel out of it, the rich side is not a safe side. goodluck.

jetblast · 10-22-2009, 02:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FiFdYnUtz

well my cars afr NA is in the low 12's i believe, i need to richen it more when i spray?

that na afr is fine man, i find that running a bit richer in na gets the extra fuel to the cylinders sooner and better distributed, you just go down in jet size one or two points until you get 12. to 12.5. it's very tough to get your afr curve to appear as a flat line throghout the entire 1/4mi run. bottle press. decreasing, the size of the shot are the variables., so i would start out at 12.5 and if your tune is decent afr should not drop too much........ just as important is the timing. to find the edge you have to spend some time doing some n/a runs and tune to 13.2 and take timing out, one or two degree at a time until you get kr, but only if your low oct table is left at least stock. i just take out about 2 deg. more than stock until i'm done with the n/a tune. once you get some kr, back off 2 deg. and then you can either leave the afr were it is or richen it up one point. then you are ready to start with the nitrous. work your way up, start with a 50hp shot just to see how your afr shows up and how your system is behaving. once that is done then you can step up to the 100, by then you should know if you need a slightly smaller jet. if you run into rich afrs make damn sure you find out why. follow the 2deg per 50 hp rule and you should be fine and running strong. as far as the plugs, i know the average wb is not entirely accurate, but since you created a reference while tuning n/a, use that as a cross ck along with the narrow bands readouts. so to me the next most important ck is the timing mark. so use the 100w as the tuning point. use a new set of plugs for the first run, and that should be your reference point for the higher shots. you can really see the timing mark on a new plug even if you don't shut it down right away. try to be as consisten as possible with each run, that means trying to make every run with the same ect. and always run the same brand and oct of fuel. 93 or better. the big dogs here in this site will tell you that the true timing mark shows up during the 1/8mi after that it changes a bit, but i don't think it changes much more after that, especially for guys just spraying a small shot like us. good luck. ask me how i know???