How much can the stock bottom end handle?? explained

[BlackZCamaro]

strapped the 125 on last night and I'm not lookin back! The car loves the small shot, especially w/ a basic catback minus cats. Lots of good info here folks, and as always, Use the search button.

[craparo]

I have a stock shortblock and dynoed 455~ rwhp, and put a 150 shot on top of it. Just make sure you have proper fuel system modifications, and proper safety precautions in place on the spray. I've never really thought twice or looked back on it.

[02NHRAtransAm]

Just picked up a 150 wet kit...
no lookin back now

[Robert56]

I didn't read through the whole thread, but will state what I have run, you be the judge. Sprayed my car about 200 passes. Have hit it with a 200rwhp shot many, many times. Hit it with a 235rwhp shot 5 times so far. Last weekend I hit it with a 250rwhp shot 2 times. Runs like a top and has never missed a beat.
Robert

[BADSZ28]

Everyone seams to be looking over my question. How high before turning off the nitrous RPM wise?

[brad8266]

Originally Posted by Bird_Of_Prey

100 Octane minimum over 125hp. I was using VP C10 Unleaded on the big shots with 22* of timing.

Thats overkill. 150 on 93 with a stock tune works. With a good AFR tune 150 is safe to spray all day long on 93 octane with stock timing. I run 93 octane with stock timing and a tune for AFR and I have no issues spraying all the time. Some 100 octane is good safety practice though, although not needed.

[brad8266]

Also how your system is designed plays a nig part in how much power it can take. If you spray a big single stage shot early in the RPM's then you are putting more stress on parts than if you used a progressive controller or dual stage. Thats why guys like robert can spray such big ass shots with no priblems with stock blocks. They arent hitting the block with all that torque at once.

[Hocky]

Originally Posted by brad8266

Thats overkill. 150 on 93 with a stock tune works. With a good AFR tune 150 is safe to spray all day long on 93 octane with stock timing. I run 93 octane with stock timing and a tune for AFR and I have no issues spraying all the time. Some 100 octane is good safety practice though, although not needed.

I've sprayed up to 250whp on 93 octane.

[Hocky]

Originally Posted by BADSZ28

Everyone seams to be looking over my question. How high before turning off the nitrous RPM wise?

I spray to 7100rpm.

[brad8266]

Originally Posted by Hocky

I spray to 7100rpm.

damn!!! What internals u running?

[Jditlfm]

Any info on the Lt1's, I always wondered if Ls1's have hypoeutectic pistons stock but could never find the answer.. I always assumed anything over a 150 on a lt1 is kind of risky for the stock pistons. Can the Ls1's take more no2 because of different pistons?

[brad8266]

LS1's are hyper pistons

[blacktransam]

Originally Posted by Robert56@NitrousDirect

I didn't read through the whole thread, but will state what I have run, you be the judge. Sprayed my car about 200 passes. Have hit it with a 200rwhp shot many, many times. Hit it with a 235rwhp shot 5 times so far. Last weekend I hit it with a 250rwhp shot 2 times. Runs like a top and has never missed a beat.
Robert

woohoo..

i love this stuff.. so robert whens the 300 jets goin in?? i heard from a little birdie that they are ALOT of fun..

also to the LT1 guy.. we sprayed a buddys stock head cc305 cam'd lt1 with a 175 for A LOOOOOOOONG time.. we tore the motor down to see what it looked like and it still had plenty of crosshatch.. that motor was re ringed and put in my gfs car which still runs like a top..

Mike

[Robert56]

Everyone seams to be looking over my question. How high before turning off the nitrous RPM wise?

Depends on your redline, I spray to 6400 and shift at 6500, then rev limiter is set at 7000rpm. basically, if ya want to save a little wear and tear on trans have spray shut off a tad before shifting. If you want to spray through the shift then set it off before hitting limiter.

i love this stuff.. so robert whens the 300 jets goin in?? i heard from a little birdie that they are ALOT of fun..

Well, not sure yet, will be doing the 285rwhp shot first. maybe sometime this fall? I do have the 3rd stage all set up and ready to go, just haven't had the sack yet.
Robert

[Jditlfm]

Originally Posted by blacktransam

woohoo..

also to the LT1 guy.. we sprayed a buddys stock head cc305 cam'd lt1 with a 175 for A LOOOOOOOONG time.. we tore the motor down to see what it looked like and it still had plenty of crosshatch.. that motor was re ringed and put in my gfs car which still runs like a top..

Mike

Was this with a plate setup or nozzles? and another question I have is when dose no2 stop being worth it? like when you have to retard the timing so much to spray a big shot, when you could actually be faster with a smaller shot but more timing, or is that well into the directport territory and we start talking about dedicated fuel systems and race gas?

[blacktransam]

it was a nozzle set up.. dry actually.. and that point is no existant.. you can only pull so much timing.. then you start adding octane..

[speed_demon24]

Originally Posted by Jditlfm

Was this with a plate setup or nozzles? and another question I have is when dose no2 stop being worth it? like when you have to retard the timing so much to spray a big shot, when you could actually be faster with a smaller shot but more timing, or is that well into the directport territory and we start talking about dedicated fuel systems and race gas?

I'm on a heads/cam stock bottom end LT1 with 95K miles on it spraying a 150rwhp shot. My tuner said I only need to pull 3 degrees of timing for the 150. I was pulling 5 with the times in my sig and I'm pretty sure I let off before the traps. I'm going to get some new times on a real tire next time though. I shift at 6500 on spray too.

[Fasglas]

Originally Posted by Jditlfm

when does no2 stop being worth it? like when you have to retard the timing so much to spray a big shot, when you could actually be faster with a smaller shot but more timing, or is that well into the directport territory and we start talking about dedicated fuel systems and race gas?

Assuming you are running good fuel, when spraying nitrous retarding the timing isn't costing you horsepower. It's all about "timing" of course. Nitrous causes a quick and violent burn. Since the burn is quicker you must retard the timing to have the peak cylinder pressure occur at the correct time in relation to the position of the piston. So retarding the timing actually makes more power and (of course) it saves the motor from distruction.

[SIC FUQR]

Originally Posted by Bird_Of_Prey

I'd like to add a little bit here. Seems in most of the writeups that spark plugs were overlooked. Please people, your stock platinum tipped plugs will HATE nitrous. With a small 125 shot on my stock LS1, I ate ground straps completely off, and burned almost every electrode. I pulled the plugs a week later and replaced with NGK TR-6's and was amazed that the car even ran with the stock Delcos in place.

Fuel. You NEED it. It's a cheap way to keep your motor safe. 100 Octane minimum over 125hp. I was using VP C10 Unleaded on the big shots with 22* of timing.

so, if i were to use a 125 shot..i would be good using premium 93 pump?

[Frost]

Originally Posted by blacktransam

......
I like to go from personal experience.. not what I have heard.. in order to spray a 200+ shot into your car make sure you have plenty of fuel.. a a/f in the 11's is what i prefer.. some say thats rich.. but I also like to give my car a 200 hit on pump gas from time to time.. a conservative timing setting of 24-26* is ideal in my eyes.. and ALL the proper supporting equipment.. Fuel pressure safety switch.. Window switch.. race gas in HIGH HP applications any thing you can do.. you can not be to safe..
.........

and enjoy handing those FI guys, like CAT3 wants to be, there asses when they least expect it..

Mike

I know this is an old post; but it's a sticky so... In MY OPINION... that's a bucket of timing to be running on a stock-blocked 200 hit. I would lean towards 20deg peak; 22 pushing it with a 200hit. I'd say that nice AFR is doing alot to protect you if you are running 26deg on a hit that big. Coming from FI I may like things a little rich, but a cushion is nice. On a 150 hit and up I prefer 11.6-11.8 AFR.

Oh yeah; nitrous works on FI cars too...