How much can the stock bottom end handle?? explained

blacktransam · 07-31-2006, 10:16 PM

Ok this is coming from the request of some and the fact that I'm tired of reading 3 of these posts a day; you guys need to learn to use the damn search button. Brains has this site working very well and you guys ignore the majority of its functions..

Now for the question, if you want the honest to God answer to that question.. here it is.. None NADA ZERO ZILCH.. NOT A FUCKING DROP.. Your car was not engineered to do anything but what it was designed to do in stock form.. I say this cause I don't want some kid with a V6 to put a 200 shot on it.. blow it up and blame me..

Now this question has many variables.. and you will hear everything from a 75 shot on stock fuel to 150 to 200 on bolt on only motors.. the amount of nitrous the stock LS1 can handle is really not your question.. what you want to know is the potential power output to the wheels of your motor reliably and consistently..

In my hoest opinion you can push a stock bottom end LS1 to the 600RWHP area WITH A SAFE TUNE for a long time.. now what is a safe tune??

My personal definition of a safe tune is one conservative on timing and a safe A/F.. RICHER IS NOT ALWAYS BETTER.. you can get to a point of cylinder wash down and begin lifting ringlands blah blah.. this is not something you want done by joe shmoe with HP tuners.. this is going to have to be done by a reputable pro on a dyno.. its prob not going to be cheap and its probably going to take a while..

Now the nitrous horror stories.. every one on here has heard the stories and has that one friend who says nitrous is so bad.. The best I can tell this basically stems from some time ago.. LONG before the technology of today.. with what these guys like Ricky and them know about atomization and fuel puddling you guys are seeing the safest and most potent nitrous kits ever to hit the market.. the days of the Blown off manifolds and such, while still happening, are not nearly as common..

Now what you all wanted to know.. what does it take to push the stock LS1 and how far will it go..

I like to go from personal experience.. not what I have heard.. in order to spray a 200+ shot into your car make sure you have plenty of fuel.. a a/f in the 11's is what i prefer.. some say thats rich.. but I also like to give my car a 200 hit on pump gas from time to time.. a conservative timing setting of 24-26* is ideal in my eyes.. and ALL the proper supporting equipment.. Fuel pressure safety switch.. Window switch.. race gas in HIGH HP applications any thing you can do.. you can not be to safe..

Guys the stock bottom end is alot tougher than most make it out to be.. and if you use your spray wisely and conservatively your LS1 will take a 200+ shot for a long time to come.. make sure your tune is spot on.. make sure you have your supporting equipment in place..

and enjoy handing those FI guys, like CAT3 wants to be, there asses when they least expect it..

Mike

silver98formula · 07-31-2006, 10:22 PM

Well put. Just mor motivation to add another stage the the FRC.

Chris

blacktransam · 07-31-2006, 10:23 PM

Go for it..

CAT3 · 07-31-2006, 11:35 PM

Mike, thanks for the write-up and hopefully more ppl will be inclined to use the search button to find things like this.

Boostaholic · 08-01-2006, 01:32 AM

wow this really goes for F/I people asking how much boost their stock bottom end will take too, of course it gets more complex with boost (Its not just pressure, you got IATs and other things to worry about) but definantly a good write up.

Oh and i think the n2o cars have a little catching up to the f/i guys

Reject · 08-01-2006, 03:06 PM

nice write up, i do wish though that the search button was a pair of tit's then EVERY one would see that

gd1996 · 08-02-2006, 03:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by reject

nice write up, i do wish though that the search button was a pair of tit's then EVERY one would see that

I'm all for it

Robert56 · 08-05-2006, 07:54 AM

I agree on most of your write up. One area I would like to add to, or rather clarify, is the manifold explosions. Actually, imo, this is more so an issue with modern plastic intakes (will expand later). A manifold of old, ie: cast iron, aluiminum and a top mounted carb was/is much less likely to blow apart. Here's why, our modern lsx intakes are of a lighter plastic which is not as strong, and the fact that the intake runners are below the plenum and mix has to go up and over, meaning the heavier fuel droplets can be less than perfect on their journey. Also, with the front mounted intake opening a back fire has a harder time escapeing compared to a top mount and thus the reason for explosion coming through the plastic intake many times.

I agree that a stock bottom lsx can in fact be run safely if the tune is up to par. But the saying will certainly apply, "If you want play, and can't pay, don't spray"

especially on the bigger hits as there are no absolute gurantees.
Robert

SPRAYIN96TA · 08-06-2006, 10:02 PM

there was a dumbass in NC who wanted to find out.....I told him 150hp tops!!! He goes and puts a 250hp on it....nitrous backfires and blows both head gaskets, and burned 2 pistons

Bird_Of_Prey · 08-10-2006, 12:00 AM

I'd like to add a little bit here. Seems in most of the writeups that spark plugs were overlooked. Please people, your stock platinum tipped plugs will HATE nitrous. With a small 125 shot on my stock LS1, I ate ground straps completely off, and burned almost every electrode. I pulled the plugs a week later and replaced with NGK TR-6's and was amazed that the car even ran with the stock Delcos in place.

Fuel. You NEED it. It's a cheap way to keep your motor safe. 100 Octane minimum over 125hp. I was using VP C10 Unleaded on the big shots with 22* of timing.

Hocky · 08-10-2006, 11:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bird_Of_Prey

Fuel. You NEED it. It's a cheap way to keep your motor safe. 100 Octane minimum over 125hp. I was using VP C10 Unleaded on the big shots with 22* of timing.

Overkill, but I guess if you want to be as safe as possible...

1 Bad Z · 08-14-2006, 07:54 PM

On a stock LS1 shortblock, as long as you know how nitrous works and how an engine uses it, You should "S-shape" bend all 8 rods and wristpins from the cylinder pressure of a big shot of nitrous like I did before you burn ANYTHING up.

I have had 2 '98 vehicles with stock shortblocks and 300-350hp worth of nitrous with over 60k miles on the clock. Might of burned a strap on a plug every now and then that's about it. Was just seeing how far I could push the stock fuel system/Walbro pump set-up.

Tip: '98 stock pistons actually have a thicker top ring land than a 2001-up.

Heres a video of my 70k mile stock shortblock/300 shot car 1.30 60 footin on the back tires. It is a prime example of how far on the ragged edge the tune was. The air was so good out there that night I actually got on the lean side and burnt my first plug (watch at the end of the pass) Notice it looses a plug before the win light comes on and it still ran a 9.70 on that pass. I just got a little greedy and really wanted to beat the guy so I jacked up my bottle pressure to about 1175 after the purge!

http://www.iconautosports.com/media/...e_chevelle.wmv

Reject · 08-14-2006, 08:28 PM

Robert56 · 08-14-2006, 11:48 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1 Bad Z

On a stock LS1 shortblock, as long as you know how nitrous works and how an engine uses it, You should "S-shape" bend all 8 rods and wristpins from the cylinder pressure of a big shot of nitrous like I did before you burn ANYTHING up.

I have had 2 '98 vehicles with stock shortblocks and 300-350hp worth of nitrous with over 60k miles on the clock. Might of burned a strap on a plug every now and then that's about it. Was just seeing how far I could push the stock fuel system/Walbro pump set-up.

Tip: '98 stock pistons actually have a thicker top ring land than a 2001-up.

Heres a video of my 70k mile stock shortblock/300 shot car 1.30 60 footin on the back tires. It is a prime example of how far on the ragged edge the tune was. The air was so good out there that night I actually got on the lean side and burnt my first plug (watch at the end of the pass) Notice it looses a plug before the win light comes on and it still ran a 9.70 on that pass. I just got a little greedy and really wanted to beat the guy so I jacked up my bottle pressure to about 1175 after the purge!

http://www.iconautosports.com/media/...e_chevelle.wmv

That's what I am talking about. everytime i talk about doing a 300 shot on my ls6, everyone says you'll blow it, we will see. If ya can't pay don't spray. Great run by the way, looks like it crapped out the whole plug.

Robert

badinfluencelsx · 08-18-2006, 05:32 PM

i think the question is more how much your transmission can handle.. my 4l60e blew the rear planitaries fast... im in a silverado tho.

Malko · 08-21-2006, 08:35 PM

omg @ 1 Bad Z

BADSZ28 · 08-29-2006, 03:34 PM

Well I think this is inline with the subject. How early and late can you spray a stock bottom end? Providing tune is right on. I know this may vary on hit size but I think this is very relevent to how much spray the bottom end can handle. I know rule of thumb is 3k to 6k. But My motor turns to 7k easily NA. Can I or should I go higher than 6k? In drag racing the motor rarely sees below 3500 though.

98FiveSeven · 09-07-2006, 08:13 PM

good thread. I am soaking it all up as this spring i want to spray my car

MrCadillac · 09-12-2006, 08:47 AM

haha, watching that chevelle fishtail the whole run made me glad I don't drive something that fast. But wow, you clearly see that spark plug hop out right before the traps.

raymond mckinney · 09-12-2006, 10:33 PM

Damn 300-350 shot it's a friggin drug i swear!!!