Detailed Review: Pacesetter Long Tubes, Texas Speed True Duals
06-11-2005, 10:20 PM
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Detailed Review: Pacesetter Long Tubes, Texas Speed True Duals Quality/Install:
Pacesetters were nice headers for the money, very nice for the money, but they are no Kooks or QTPs thats for sure. Most obvious in the merge collector. Regardless, they went in without a single hitch and fit very well on the car, and make power just the same. Zero clearance problems from the headers.
Texas Speed true dual kit with Moroso Spiral Flow mufflers was a decent kit. Just raw metal so nothing fancy there. I didn't realize I had to drill my own holes for the hangers, wasn't too happy about that, but you gotta do what you gotta do. Its tucked up to the bottom of the car HARD. No way its getting any higher, and the lowest part is the driver's side pipe where everyone's is the lowest. No room to go up there. X-pipe and mufflers are fine from the ground. One spot on the passenger's side is touching (muffler is touching the frame), but that side is also bolted a little too high, so I'll probably drop that down a little which should correct that problem. Also touches the brake lines on the driver's side in one spot, and is VERY close to the torque arm. Heat tape between the fuel lines and the muffler. Had to loose the tunnel brace, no room for the exhaust (y-pipe would have been the same).
*NOTE: The upcoming part about sound are my opinions, and it needs to be factored in that I'm a VERY picky person when it comes to my own exhaust. If its too far off it really irritates me. I had full stock exhaust with a post-axle cutout and the resonance and drone inside drove me nuts, so I had a bullet muffler welded into the i-pipe, and that helped alot. It doesn't take much to set me off on an exhaust, so keep that in mind as you read the following.
Sound/Performance:
Idle -- First start and we all had cheese eating grins on our faces, at least I know I did.
When I pulled under the carport after getting home tonight, I left the car idleing outside, and brought my springs inside, and the little trinkets and plates and whatnot in the hutch were rattling. When I was back into stereos and alot of bass and I cranked the music on the carport it used to rattle that stuff the same way. This thing sounds amazing at idle. Cant wait to drop that baby T1 cam in next weekend. 
Low Spees/Acceleration -- Parking lot/starting speeds, there is a little rattling inside the car. Just starting off from red lights and such, the true duals have so much bass to the exhaust note that it drowns out the Monsoon's lower notes, but at cruise I have to listen to the Monsoon maybe one or two clicks higher to get the same volume. At steady speeds with very little throttle input, its really not loud at all regardless of RPM. Conversations are no problem, had a phone conversation for some of the drive home, no big deal. No drone or resonance or anything. I got up to 70 MPH on the way home to test crusing sounds. Might be bad at 80 MPH, but I doubt it. Slightly louder than the Hooker catback on stock manifolds on the road/highway once at crusing speeds.
Part throttle acceleration -- However, ANY kind of acceleration and you know its got long tubes, no cats, and dumps. The more acceleration, the more noise. Your right foot controls how much you want to make. Outside I'm sure it sounds awesome, but inside it sounds kind of weird. At part throttle acceleration, it's a mix between the exhaust note and some slight resonance that makes it sound funny. Outside I'm sure it sounds great, but inside if you have to speed up to make a legal pass or something, it sounds kind of funny with that resonance. Now if you're making an illegal pass...
Drop the hammerr -- WOT, downright mean.
Its got that higher pitched LS1 note, but it just screams and definitely is more muscular/throaty than a y-pipe setup. Got three decent hits on it. First was a slow roll into the gas and it was just noise. Second was a downshift to 2nd at 55 MPH and the car pulled VERY nicely. Definitely an increase in power, especially in the midrange. Third hit was downright scary. 50 MPH in the rain = no good apparently. I was ready to take my ball and go home at this point, at which point I pulled into my driveway and scraped. 
Hope I just took it at a bad angle this time, but time will tell.
Conclusion:
Overall, I'm very happy. Very happy with the sound and performance, and also very happy its not my daily driver, because I think it would get on my nerves after a while. Very nice sounding though, just loud and low.
Pics and video to come soon hopefully. We got some pics and video on a buddy's camera so we'll see how they turn out. Will make a seperate thread when that time comes.
*All of this was with the windows up. Haven't tried windows down or t-tops out.
Updated Review w/ Pictures of Clearance: https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...52#post3257152
Pacesetters were nice headers for the money, very nice for the money, but they are no Kooks or QTPs thats for sure. Most obvious in the merge collector. Regardless, they went in without a single hitch and fit very well on the car, and make power just the same. Zero clearance problems from the headers.
Texas Speed true dual kit with Moroso Spiral Flow mufflers was a decent kit. Just raw metal so nothing fancy there. I didn't realize I had to drill my own holes for the hangers, wasn't too happy about that, but you gotta do what you gotta do. Its tucked up to the bottom of the car HARD. No way its getting any higher, and the lowest part is the driver's side pipe where everyone's is the lowest. No room to go up there. X-pipe and mufflers are fine from the ground. One spot on the passenger's side is touching (muffler is touching the frame), but that side is also bolted a little too high, so I'll probably drop that down a little which should correct that problem. Also touches the brake lines on the driver's side in one spot, and is VERY close to the torque arm. Heat tape between the fuel lines and the muffler. Had to loose the tunnel brace, no room for the exhaust (y-pipe would have been the same).
*NOTE: The upcoming part about sound are my opinions, and it needs to be factored in that I'm a VERY picky person when it comes to my own exhaust. If its too far off it really irritates me. I had full stock exhaust with a post-axle cutout and the resonance and drone inside drove me nuts, so I had a bullet muffler welded into the i-pipe, and that helped alot. It doesn't take much to set me off on an exhaust, so keep that in mind as you read the following.
Sound/Performance:
Idle -- First start and we all had cheese eating grins on our faces, at least I know I did.
When I pulled under the carport after getting home tonight, I left the car idleing outside, and brought my springs inside, and the little trinkets and plates and whatnot in the hutch were rattling. When I was back into stereos and alot of bass and I cranked the music on the carport it used to rattle that stuff the same way. This thing sounds amazing at idle. Cant wait to drop that baby T1 cam in next weekend. Low Spees/Acceleration -- Parking lot/starting speeds, there is a little rattling inside the car. Just starting off from red lights and such, the true duals have so much bass to the exhaust note that it drowns out the Monsoon's lower notes, but at cruise I have to listen to the Monsoon maybe one or two clicks higher to get the same volume. At steady speeds with very little throttle input, its really not loud at all regardless of RPM. Conversations are no problem, had a phone conversation for some of the drive home, no big deal. No drone or resonance or anything. I got up to 70 MPH on the way home to test crusing sounds. Might be bad at 80 MPH, but I doubt it. Slightly louder than the Hooker catback on stock manifolds on the road/highway once at crusing speeds.
Part throttle acceleration -- However, ANY kind of acceleration and you know its got long tubes, no cats, and dumps. The more acceleration, the more noise. Your right foot controls how much you want to make. Outside I'm sure it sounds awesome, but inside it sounds kind of weird. At part throttle acceleration, it's a mix between the exhaust note and some slight resonance that makes it sound funny. Outside I'm sure it sounds great, but inside if you have to speed up to make a legal pass or something, it sounds kind of funny with that resonance. Now if you're making an illegal pass...
Drop the hammerr -- WOT, downright mean.
Its got that higher pitched LS1 note, but it just screams and definitely is more muscular/throaty than a y-pipe setup. Got three decent hits on it. First was a slow roll into the gas and it was just noise. Second was a downshift to 2nd at 55 MPH and the car pulled VERY nicely. Definitely an increase in power, especially in the midrange. Third hit was downright scary. 50 MPH in the rain = no good apparently. I was ready to take my ball and go home at this point, at which point I pulled into my driveway and scraped. Hope I just took it at a bad angle this time, but time will tell. Conclusion:
Overall, I'm very happy. Very happy with the sound and performance, and also very happy its not my daily driver, because I think it would get on my nerves after a while. Very nice sounding though, just loud and low.
Pics and video to come soon hopefully. We got some pics and video on a buddy's camera so we'll see how they turn out. Will make a seperate thread when that time comes.
*All of this was with the windows up. Haven't tried windows down or t-tops out.
Updated Review w/ Pictures of Clearance: https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...52#post3257152
Last edited by josh99ta; 07-27-2005 at 02:44 PM.
06-12-2005, 09:41 AM
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Good review. I was really happy with the fitment and quality of my pacesetter headers, as stated before they are no Kooks or QTPs, but you can't beat them for the price.
Kevin
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06-12-2005, 09:53 AM
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This review couldn't have come at a better time because I am installing the exact same set-up Thursday. Also a good review
Thanks for the info,
Kyle
Thanks for the info,
Kyle
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06-12-2005, 08:49 PM
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I wanted the Moroso mufflers, but after waiting weeks on end, I needed my car back. I had TSP send me the system w/ the bullets because they were in stock. They sound mean, but drone like crazy and vibrate my center console. I am considering buying some Moroso mufflers and welding them on w/ the turn downs angled at each other instead of straight down.
Wish you lived closer, would like to ride in your car and see how it compares as far as interior noise & resonance. I had the Moroso mufflers years ago on my SS 396 69' Camaro, but it had tail pipes and wasn't bad at all. Not really an equal comparisson to my current car. I may switch to them again... my car is my only car and on highway trips it irritates me at times. I'd like it a little bit quieter, but don't want to give up any power. Somedays I miss my SLP dual-dual - QTP cut out set up.
Wish you lived closer, would like to ride in your car and see how it compares as far as interior noise & resonance. I had the Moroso mufflers years ago on my SS 396 69' Camaro, but it had tail pipes and wasn't bad at all. Not really an equal comparisson to my current car. I may switch to them again... my car is my only car and on highway trips it irritates me at times. I'd like it a little bit quieter, but don't want to give up any power. Somedays I miss my SLP dual-dual - QTP cut out set up.
06-12-2005, 09:53 PM
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There is definitely some resonance from 1800-2000 which is about 80mph in 6th but nothing annoying. The best way I can summarize my setup is it retains the deep muscle car tone and characteristics of open headers but without the rasp and MUCH MUCH quieter, very similar to Elenor in Gone In 60 Seconds. You still have the cackle when shifting and when slowing down in 1st at around 1700 it kinda has a lope to it like a cammed car. It's very addicting.
Jason
Jason
06-12-2005, 10:44 PM
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Standard TSP true duals price, $420 I think.
Do you have the Spiral Flows? I have zero drone from 1800-2000 RPMs once at highway speeds. Matter of fact, I have zero drone period (I consider drone to be like a cutout car, which gives me a headache pretty fast). There is a little resonance (kind of a reverberation in the cabin, but its just sound, its not like it gets inside your head like drone does). I've heard the bullet mufflers are bad in that range though.
Originally Posted by Camaro99SS
There is definitely some resonance from 1800-2000 which is about 80mph in 6th but nothing annoying. The best way I can summarize my setup is it retains the deep muscle car tone and characteristics of open headers but without the rasp and MUCH MUCH quieter, very similar to Elenor in Gone In 60 Seconds. You still have the cackle when shifting and when slowing down in 1st at around 1700 it kinda has a lope to it like a cammed car. It's very addicting.
Jason
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07-27-2005, 03:56 PM
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I didn't realize I had to drill my own holes for the hangers, wasn't too happy about that, but you gotta do what you gotta do.
07-27-2005, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by josh99ta
Standard TSP true duals price, $420 I think.
Do you have the Spiral Flows? I have zero drone from 1800-2000 RPMs once at highway speeds. Matter of fact, I have zero drone period (I consider drone to be like a cutout car, which gives me a headache pretty fast). There is a little resonance (kind of a reverberation in the cabin, but its just sound, its not like it gets inside your head like drone does). I've heard the bullet mufflers are bad in that range though.
Do you have the Spiral Flows? I have zero drone from 1800-2000 RPMs once at highway speeds. Matter of fact, I have zero drone period (I consider drone to be like a cutout car, which gives me a headache pretty fast). There is a little resonance (kind of a reverberation in the cabin, but its just sound, its not like it gets inside your head like drone does). I've heard the bullet mufflers are bad in that range though.
Yeah that's the way mine is. It doesn't bother me or give me any headaches, but it is pretty loud, just how I like it. I have the Twisters which are the same as the Spiral Flows.
Now my buddy is almost done building a 383 LT1 for his 94 T/A. He got the Jegs 3" universal X pipe duals with Bullets. With 11.4:1 compression and no tailpipes like my setup, his car will drone though...
Jason
07-28-2005, 08:48 AM
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Originally Posted by Lane
You didn't use the factory true dual hanger mounts?
07-28-2005, 11:20 AM
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Originally Posted by Lane
For those that may get duals later - NEVER use the seat belt mounts for hangers in any way. It will only tear them up and create major problems down the road.
Good to know. Thanks for the advice Lane.
