I know not to use a tall deck block Zane but why do you think n20 is the way to go? I know I can make the same amount of power either way but I hate having to fill up a bottle all the time and I also want to be able to cruise a low rpms because it will be a T-56 car. Also does anyone know what an F2R costs? I can never seem to find any prices on Prochargers on the net, its like its a secret or something.
Like i said, you will beat 95% of the rides you run across on motor, you think a full bolt on cobra with a tune and pulley can fuck with a light ass third gen with a 496 making 700 FWHP? Nope...then there is the Supras that you need the spray for, and it isnt like there are thousands of them everywhere you go, you will not need the dope verry often.The price of a blower to make the power you want...too much for me, but that is my opinion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by KCS
I didn't say he HAD to use a tall deck block, I said he could. He doesn't HAVE to go 570+ci, but he could and he wouldn't need a "huge solid roller" to make 1000hp. He could get away with a hydraulic roller and some decent springs which would probably last forever.
I do believe an aftermarket block is almost required for this kind of power.
Nope, a 4 bolt 454 block can handle 1500 HP no problem. Solid roller street motors last a long time, and by huge, it depends on the definition, 260/270 @.050 in a big block is not that big, and that should take it to 7000 RPM.
The weight argument it stupid, compare a Warhawk LS motor to a all aluminum BBC, the weight difference is worth it to me with the kazillion more cubes.
Nope, a 4 bolt 454 block can handle 1500 HP no problem. Solid roller street motors last a long time, and by huge, it depends on the definition, 260/270 @.050 in a big block is not that big, and that should take it to 7000 RPM.
No problem? Like streetcar dependable, no issues whatsoever? On stock caps? No headgasket probelms with 1500hp? I'd rather get the stronger block, with 4 bolt splayed billet mains and ARP main studs already included, and get the priority main oiling and provisions for the extra headbolt as well. Like I said, it's almost required unless you have a budget way under 20K or you are just trying to prove something.
A hydraulic roller can turn 7000 on a BBC pretty easily, especially with 11/32" or smaller valves. You don't need a big solid roller, or the increased spring pressures that come with it, just for 7000RPM.
632 with base 18 degree big Chiefs will get you there with no blower or turbo. Use the Eagle Crank and rods to keep price down.
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No problem? Like streetcar dependable, no issues whatsoever? On stock caps? No headgasket probelms with 1500hp? I'd rather get the stronger block, with 4 bolt splayed billet mains and ARP main studs already included, and get the priority main oiling and provisions for the extra headbolt as well. Like I said, it's almost required unless you have a budget way under 20K or you are just trying to prove something.
A hydraulic roller can turn 7000 on a BBC pretty easily, especially with 11/32" or smaller valves. You don't need a big solid roller, or the increased spring pressures that come with it, just for 7000RPM.
Yes, you can do FI on a stock 4 bolt BBC, of course you need the ARP hardwayre, that is a given, have you seen a 4 bolt big block? It isnot just WAY bigger than a SBC, but AL the mains are 4 bolt(5), not just the center 3. A splayed BBC will go WAY further than that.
Solid roller is just the extra power you can un lock, i have several people that run mechanical on the street without problems, very streetable. No issues really.
The weight argument it stupid, compare a Warhawk LS motor to a all aluminum BBC, the weight difference is worth it to me with the kazillion more cubes.
and a 496 with a 300 shot is not overkill? Sorry but a blower will be a lot easier on a motor then that big of a hit.
I was just saying that using a 540 and a F1 to only make 1,000whp is overkill. A Procharged 540 should be well above that and if you build that combo to only make 1K, it's a waste.
A 496 with 2 stages or a progressive controller would be more streetable, cheaper to build and cost less money to maintain. It could also handle probably 85% of the cars it runs into, a least here in Dallas where all the fast cars are from
Also does anyone know what an F2R costs? I can never seem to find any prices on Prochargers on the net, its like its a secret or something.
I believe that the F series runs about $2,500 to $3,000 for the headunit depending where you buy. If you are able to find one used it will be lower than that obviously, but they are hard to find.
A 496 with 2 stages or a progressive controller would be more streetable, cheaper to build and cost less money to maintain. It could also handle probably 85% of the cars it runs into, a least here in Texas where all the fast cars are from
The weight argument it stupid, compare a Warhawk LS motor to a all aluminum BBC, the weight difference is worth it to me with the kazillion more cubes.
Yes, you can do FI on a stock 4 bolt BBC, of course you need the ARP hardwayre, that is a given, have you seen a 4 bolt big block? It isnot just WAY bigger than a SBC, but AL the mains are 4 bolt(5), not just the center 3. A splayed BBC will go WAY further than that.
Solid roller is just the extra power you can un lock, i have several people that run mechanical on the street without problems, very streetable. No issues really.
Of course you can do FI on a stock block, but you claimed 1500hp. No arguement that it could be done, but making 1500hp on a stock OEM block in a streetcar is almost pointless unless you are on a strict budget or just trying to prove something. The price difference after buying the stock BBC, then initial cleaning, converting to billet caps, buying ARP studs, and getting the block align bored, the price difference is almost negligable.
How does a solid roller "unlock" more power if you are just gonna turn 7000rpm? A hydraulic roller can handle that and never need adjustment.
i guess for a build of this type i would favor a dart block for the build.
or a world block. i think a t56 behind a bbc with some serious heads and solid roller would be a handful, and would need serious driver mod
Of course you can do FI on a stock block, but you claimed 1500hp. No arguement that it could be done, but making 1500hp on a stock OEM block in a streetcar is almost pointless unless you are on a strict budget or just trying to prove something. The price difference after buying the stock BBC, then initial cleaning, converting to billet caps, buying ARP studs, and getting the block align bored, the price difference is almost negligable.
How does a solid roller "unlock" more power if you are just gonna turn 7000rpm? A hydraulic roller can handle that and never need adjustment.
Well, i dont know how much it ti to get machine work done where you are, but between that and not really needing the billet main caps for 1500 HP, it is not pointless. The blocks are simply goof for it, we are not talking SBC or LSX, these things can handle the power with the few machine work you need.
As for "unlocking" power with solid roller...it simply makes 30-50 more HP than hydraulic cams. And yes, once set the first time if it is done right, you need to check the lash and then never usually worry about it again with good parts.
The weight argument it stupid, compare a Warhawk LS motor to a all aluminum BBC, the weight difference is worth it to me with the kazillion more cubes.
I know not to use a tall deck block Zane but why do you think n20 is the way to go? I know I can make the same amount of power either way but I hate having to fill up a bottle all the time and I also want to be able to cruise a low rpms because it will be a T-56 car. Also does anyone know what an F2R costs? I can never seem to find any prices on Prochargers on the net, its like its a secret or something.
Give me a call at 260 244-4808 for a great price on an F2R kit, much lower than what ProCharger allows in print. Bob
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I would look at a mowtown sbc block with the bigblock displacement. get some afr heads on her and turbo it i would put some twin turbos. There is actually a guy on the team camaro web form who just made 800 rwhp on his turbo kit on a small block. I want to say the kit was 6k but with that kit and the mowtown block a callies crank to make it a 490 something displacement i think theirs is a little different. I would only assume 17 k in it. Block is like 3000 but its good to 2000 hp which is way higher than any other block you could get for that much. Also you would be way above 1000 if you could have him dial up the turbo size for you.
If you wanted to do a used block i would recommend sleeving all the cylinders and get some afr's on her.
Or if you could really find it a SB2.2 set up that would unbelievable power on the mowtown block that would take small block heads with big block displacement. Just my thought my dream engine is the sb2.2 on the top of the mowtown block turboed out.
Another quick suggestion is to consider a mowtown ls series block that uses the small block internals. Just the LS series heads and intake. So pretty much a sb2 type setup. Easily capable of high power.
AFR heads are sick nasty I would go w/o FI and put a supercharger or a procharger on it may have to be adding some octane booster to your 93 lol but you are def. gonna want an aftermarket block and i wouldnt spray it unless you plan on refilling a bottle constantly with a super/pro charger u dont have to fill up a bottle and worry about the pressure of it and if its close to empty im not saying u wont have problems but... i wouldnt go with spray unless u wanna replace main bearings every year either...
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oh i have a funny suspicion that 20 grand wouldnt buy that motor. just a small one. i think you ought to do the big block with the f2 if you plan on having it in japan. 1000 hp supras are a dime a dozen over there. no sense in having to get your bottle filled every other day.
^Its going in my 87, check my sig for pics and a few vids. On my old setup I was 500ish FWHP on motor and alot more on bottle, I rarely ever got beat while spraying and i ran a few 600-800hp Supras. I just think if im gonna do a build I might as well go all the way, and the driver mod is definitely there, I broke a shifter in half last year and bent the rail I dont know if thats good but rowing gears and pedal finesse has won me most of my races. Im not worried about having a handful on the street, Im gonna die early anyways so i might as well do it in a 8 sec car And I dont want a sbc or an LS motor, they aint got shit on a BBC and arent any cheaper to build. My main concern is simplicity, I need to be able to build this entire car in a matter of weeks after ive ordered al the parts. A turbo setup or some crazy tall deck block would require way too much work so thats why i was thinking 565 or less and either a bottle or a procharger. Can i build a smooth idling 1000+hp N20 BBC? I know a mild cammed, AFR headed, procharged 540 could easily do the job on pump gas. I also want to assemble as much of it as possible with my own hands, like Zanes sig says "built not bought". Thabks for the suggestions though, lets keep em coming
And I dont want a sbc or an LS motor, they aint got shit on a BBC and arent any cheaper to build. My main concern is simplicity, I need to be able to build this entire car in a matter of weeks after ive ordered al the parts. A turbo setup or some crazy tall deck block would require way too much work so thats why i was thinking 565 or less and either a bottle or a procharger. Can i build a smooth idling 1000+hp N20 BBC? I know a mild cammed, AFR headed, procharged 540 could easily do the job on pump gas. I also want to assemble as much of it as possible with my own hands, like Zanes sig says "built not bought". Thabks for the suggestions though, lets keep em coming
