l92 heads lifting???
This isn't an LG vs VA Speed thread Ed. I back you guys more than you know, so please dont turn this into a war that it isn't.
You guys are the ONLY reason that gives 4 bolt guys hope. Kurt Urban, first car in the 6s, couldnt keep the heads on it. It pushed so much water, it needed a bypass valve on it to keep the coolant in the motor. He and Mike Moran are no dummies.
Lets look at the timeline of events- If O-Ringing was as good as you make it out to be, why were there even castings and blocks made with 6 bolt setups?! In order to make new blocks, new heads, new R&D, there had to be a reason. People dont make new parts unless there is a need. Necessity is the mother of invention, is it not?
Hey, Lets add 2 more bolts to our heads because we dont need to!
Why does phil run a 6 bolt setup? Why does Vee8 run a 6 bolt setup? Why does LMR run a 6 bolt setup? Why did Mightymouse swap to a 6 bolt?
If the 4 bolt setup is working, why are these pioneers running 6 bolt setups?
Again, lets step back, forget what you are selling, and see whats best for the consumer.
You guys are the ONLY reason that gives 4 bolt guys hope. Kurt Urban, first car in the 6s, couldnt keep the heads on it. It pushed so much water, it needed a bypass valve on it to keep the coolant in the motor. He and Mike Moran are no dummies.
Lets look at the timeline of events- If O-Ringing was as good as you make it out to be, why were there even castings and blocks made with 6 bolt setups?! In order to make new blocks, new heads, new R&D, there had to be a reason. People dont make new parts unless there is a need. Necessity is the mother of invention, is it not?
Hey, Lets add 2 more bolts to our heads because we dont need to!
Why does phil run a 6 bolt setup? Why does Vee8 run a 6 bolt setup? Why does LMR run a 6 bolt setup? Why did Mightymouse swap to a 6 bolt?
If the 4 bolt setup is working, why are these pioneers running 6 bolt setups?
Again, lets step back, forget what you are selling, and see whats best for the consumer.
We're not talking about 4 bolt heads working in 2000 hp motors. We're talking about them working in 1000, 1200 hp motors. And they do.
You're talking about using 6 bolt blocks for 800 rwhp, as if THEY ARE REQUIRED, and they're not.
That's all. No need to drag it through the mud.
This isn't an LG vs VA Speed thread Ed. I back you guys more than you know, so please dont turn this into a war that it isn't.
You guys are the ONLY reason that gives 4 bolt guys hope. Kurt Urban, first car in the 6s, couldnt keep the heads on it. It pushed so much water, it needed a bypass valve on it to keep the coolant in the motor. He and Mike Moran are no dummies.
Lets look at the timeline of events- If O-Ringing was as good as you make it out to be, why were there even castings and blocks made with 6 bolt setups?! In order to make new blocks, new heads, new R&D, there had to be a reason. People dont make new parts unless there is a need. Necessity is the mother of invention, is it not?
Hey, Lets add 2 more bolts to our heads because we dont need to!
Why does phil run a 6 bolt setup? Why does Vee8 run a 6 bolt setup? Why does LMR run a 6 bolt setup? Why did Mightymouse swap to a 6 bolt?
If the 4 bolt setup is working, why are these pioneers running 6 bolt setups?
Again, lets step back, forget what you are selling, and see whats best for the consumer.
You guys are the ONLY reason that gives 4 bolt guys hope. Kurt Urban, first car in the 6s, couldnt keep the heads on it. It pushed so much water, it needed a bypass valve on it to keep the coolant in the motor. He and Mike Moran are no dummies.
Lets look at the timeline of events- If O-Ringing was as good as you make it out to be, why were there even castings and blocks made with 6 bolt setups?! In order to make new blocks, new heads, new R&D, there had to be a reason. People dont make new parts unless there is a need. Necessity is the mother of invention, is it not?
Hey, Lets add 2 more bolts to our heads because we dont need to!
Why does phil run a 6 bolt setup? Why does Vee8 run a 6 bolt setup? Why does LMR run a 6 bolt setup? Why did Mightymouse swap to a 6 bolt?
If the 4 bolt setup is working, why are these pioneers running 6 bolt setups?
Again, lets step back, forget what you are selling, and see whats best for the consumer.
This is not about SELLING-it about giving people an alternative to buying a $2300.00 block and a new set of heads.If i can make what they currently have work-why not.
Just because you have not seen it personally does not make it impossible.
Technology progresses-things that were impossible 4 years ago are possible today-why can't this hold true in this case?
I never once said the 6 bolt wasn't better-just not always needed.
People makes parts because they can make MONEY on them-not always because they are needed-the whole idea is to make something and tell everybody that anything else will not work-it's called marketing.
I can make alot more money SELLINGan lsx block and machining it than i can doing some orings-you figure it out.
FYI-veee8's 1500hp STREET engine is 4 bolt with my oring setup-we only went with the 6 bolt on his race engine because he got a great deal on a 6 bolt c5r block and heads.
Last edited by Shawn @ VA Speed; Nov 3, 2009 at 11:37 AM.
This isn't an LG vs VA Speed thread Ed. I back you guys more than you know, so please dont turn this into a war that it isn't.
You guys are the ONLY reason that gives 4 bolt guys hope. Kurt Urban, first car in the 6s, couldnt keep the heads on it. It pushed so much water, it needed a bypass valve on it to keep the coolant in the motor. He and Mike Moran are no dummies.
Lets look at the timeline of events- If O-Ringing was as good as you make it out to be, why were there even castings and blocks made with 6 bolt setups?! In order to make new blocks, new heads, new R&D, there had to be a reason. People dont make new parts unless there is a need. Necessity is the mother of invention, is it not?
Hey, Lets add 2 more bolts to our heads because we dont need to!
Why does phil run a 6 bolt setup? Why does Vee8 run a 6 bolt setup? Why does LMR run a 6 bolt setup? Why did Mightymouse swap to a 6 bolt?
If the 4 bolt setup is working, why are these pioneers running 6 bolt setups?
Again, lets step back, forget what you are selling, and see whats best for the consumer.
You guys are the ONLY reason that gives 4 bolt guys hope. Kurt Urban, first car in the 6s, couldnt keep the heads on it. It pushed so much water, it needed a bypass valve on it to keep the coolant in the motor. He and Mike Moran are no dummies.
Lets look at the timeline of events- If O-Ringing was as good as you make it out to be, why were there even castings and blocks made with 6 bolt setups?! In order to make new blocks, new heads, new R&D, there had to be a reason. People dont make new parts unless there is a need. Necessity is the mother of invention, is it not?
Hey, Lets add 2 more bolts to our heads because we dont need to!
Why does phil run a 6 bolt setup? Why does Vee8 run a 6 bolt setup? Why does LMR run a 6 bolt setup? Why did Mightymouse swap to a 6 bolt?
If the 4 bolt setup is working, why are these pioneers running 6 bolt setups?
Again, lets step back, forget what you are selling, and see whats best for the consumer.
300.00 bucks to oring a block vs 2100 for a new block. 2100.00 is a lot more money. what would you do, i can fix you motor setup for 300 bucks. or i can sell you a 2100.00 block, put 3k worth of heads on it. hours more of labor for assembly. you get the point. buick guys run tons of boost on 4 bolt heads, with orings, oring were popular and then fell off. ive always had great success with them. my cars nothing crazy fast, but 317s with an oring block, mls $39.99 a pair gaskets runs 6.0 at 119mph in full weight all day never pushing water. thats fast enough for the majority out there. even if i had a 6 bolt setup, i would still oring it.
300.00 bucks to oring a block vs 2100 for a new block. 2100.00 is a lot more money. what would you do, i can fix you motor setup for 300 bucks. or i can sell you a 2100.00 block, put 3k worth of heads on it. hours more of labor for assembly. you get the point. buick guys run tons of boost on 4 bolt heads, with orings, oring were popular and then fell off. ive always had great success with them. my cars nothing crazy fast, but 317s with an oring block, mls $39.99 a pair gaskets runs 6.0 at 119mph in full weight all day never pushing water. thats fast enough for the majority out there. even if i had a 6 bolt setup, i would still oring it.
Do you o-ring the block or the heads or both? can you do this and raise the cc of the head to lower compression? Just asking because I have L92 heads and I am running 10.25:1 compression ratio and I would like to lower the compression as much as possible and put more boost to it to hit 800+rwhp.
Okay so high cylinder pressure makes the engine push water... does the compression ratio effect cylinder pressure... like it does the threshold for detonation? Would dropping the compression ratio let you run more hp before you push water?
Do you o-ring the block or the heads or both? can you do this and raise the cc of the head to lower compression? Just asking because I have L92 heads and I am running 10.25:1 compression ratio and I would like to lower the compression as much as possible and put more boost to it to hit 800+rwhp.
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Anyone have a written process for o-ringing (drawing)? Like the double setup? What o-rings? Part numbers? I'd pay the $300. to have it done but I think it would be costly to ship my stuff from WI. And any machine shop in this area I have to make a detailed print what I want done and even what I dont want machined and then babysit them to make sure they do it right.
I know its not related... to a gas motor... but the duramax uses really 5 bolts per cylinder, sharing 2 bolts between each piston. 22 bolts in total to hold each head on. I run 30-32 PSI boost stock with my race tune... I'm sure my cylinder pressures are up there.
Good thread here. Could you guys that push 4 bolt heads past 1000-1200hp share what needs to be done to help heads live? If it's not a great secret. I'm trying to push my LS1/Patriot heads past 800whp, preferably upto 1000-1100whp. Is this even possible?
Like I said, we do it differently here.
Actually, if your car doesnt make 1000 down here, you are not fast. Multiple pulls, "cruises" gumball style.
Try doing 3-5 texas mile style pulls with in a 20-30 minute span, no cool down, no time to turn the car around, no maintenance, no nothing. Weird **** happens, and it forces you to be a better tech. If Your customers always break, people do not bring their car to you anymore.
This is why the racecar=/=streetcar. 15 seconds of run time with an 8 second car =/= a texas mile pull. trust me, I know.
Actually, if your car doesnt make 1000 down here, you are not fast. Multiple pulls, "cruises" gumball style.
Try doing 3-5 texas mile style pulls with in a 20-30 minute span, no cool down, no time to turn the car around, no maintenance, no nothing. Weird **** happens, and it forces you to be a better tech. If Your customers always break, people do not bring their car to you anymore.
This is why the racecar=/=streetcar. 15 seconds of run time with an 8 second car =/= a texas mile pull. trust me, I know.
A TBSS here in town is making 1200whp on 26lbs of boost through ported L92 heads without any issues. People here see people posting about L92s lifting with boost, and then regurgitate it like they have experienced it. Just build your **** right, tune it correctly, and you shouldn't have any issues.
A TBSS here in town is making 1200whp on 26lbs of boost through ported L92 heads without any issues. People here see people posting about L92s lifting with boost, and then regurgitate it like they have experienced it. Just build your **** right, tune it correctly, and you shouldn't have any issues.
stock GM heads?Do they have more meat than LS1 heads?
well i currently just went to a tfs 6 bolt set of heads, but still have a 4 bolt block.. im having no issues at 20psi nor did i with factory 317s last year.. im running a ls9 gasket and arp l-19 head studs.. a correct camshaft will alllow you to run more boost with less lifting issues as well keep that in mind.. it not allways up to head studs and gaskets..
