CTS-V brakes, something different
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From: Anheuser Busch, Houston Texas
Originally Posted by Darkspoon
I have no idea how I didn't see that...haha I read the post like three times. I guess I was thinkin of the regular CTS's that have 5 lug wheels.. 
another random thought...think the c6 z06 rotors would work at all?
another random thought...think the c6 z06 rotors would work at all?
The c5 advantage is that blanks can be had for $16. They are a 12.8" rotor but I had not considered the offset problem.
Essentially does this problem not come down to bracketry? To hang another caliper you need a bracket. To clamp a bigger rotor you need a better caliper (hopefully full of more pistons) farther away from the spindle. So really you just need the bracket...eveything else already exists on some other vehicle, if I read correctly, no?
we are currently experimenting with rotors... trying to use the cheapest possible.. I will update this thread.. once I have something to report. I work 12 hour days so I do not get a lot of time to work this project, not as much as I would like anyway
Staging Lane
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 79
Likes: 0
From: Bethesda, MD
Ya I know the c6 z06 uses the same rotor..i was just saying for thickness issues...and I know they aint that cheap..but those + these calipers and lines is still way less than the brembo kit...
any progress on this?
any progress on this?
How about coming out with a bracket to bolt up C6 Z06 calipers but with a 13 inch rotor or the C5 rotor,would it work.Maybe all the ZR1 wheel guys can to that and not worry about upgrading to 18"wheels.
Originally Posted by Darkspoon
Ya I know the c6 z06 uses the same rotor..i was just saying for thickness issues...and I know they aint that cheap..but those + these calipers and lines is still way less than the brembo kit...
any progress on this?
any progress on this?
the same rotor as what?? the CTS-V is a 6 lug.. not 5 like the C6 Z06.. the rotors are not the same, each have their own backspacing..
update:
I have located a part supplier (shall remain nameless since we can not mention " non-sponsors") and so far this is what I have.
I have found some 12.9" 2 piece rotors.. using a 1" or 27mm backspace Hat. Rotors are $183 each.. Hats are $157.. hardware for the 2 peice rotors are $60 per rotor.
so to give you a total..
112$ per caliper(without pads) from GMparts direct(+ their 20% shipping BS)
$73 for Stainless brake lines
$157 per hat x2
$183 per rotor x2
$60 hardware for hats x2
pads are your choice.. minimum price I have seen are 50$
bracket for mounting + grade 8 hardware is roughly 140$ (so I have been quoted)..
total: with out shipping costs $1,258.80
I tried to cut costs by using a C5 12.8" rotor.. problem is the backspace.. its shallower than the F-body rotor (fbody rotor is 21.9mm.. C5 is 15.6mm).. and pushes the rotor closer to the wheel..which we dont want since this Brembo is very thick and will over hang by 33.75mm..
If i could find a GM rotor like the Fbody with a 21.9mm back space (we actually need a 27mm).. we could use a 1/4"(6.3mm) spacer and be OK.. BUT.. i can not find a 5x4.75 12.8" or greater diameter with a deep backspace.. hence the reason for 2 piece rotors..
thickness of the rotor should not be less than 30mm and no greater than 33mm (stock Fbody is 31mm.. stock C5 is 32mm)
the wheel I am using is a 1999 Camaro SS 17x9.5" (ZR1 style) with the 38mm backspacing.
So unless I can find a cheaper price on rotors/hats or 1 peice rotors that will work.. I wouldnt go this route.. since there are alternative packages from various vendors that we can get for just a tad higher for a complete kit. I will still search around for a rotor combo that will sufice.
to be continued...
Last edited by GR33N GoblinM6; Sep 25, 2006 at 03:06 PM.
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Staging Lane
Joined: Mar 2005
Posts: 79
Likes: 0
From: Bethesda, MD
Originally Posted by GR33N GoblinM6
the same rotor as what?? the CTS-V is a 6 lug.. not 5 like the C6 Z06.. the rotors are not the same, each have their own backspacing..
to be continued...
to be continued...
i can not find a 5x4.75 12.8" or greater diameter with a deep backspace.. hence the reason for 2 piece rotors..
Originally Posted by 00 Trans Ram
I wonder if there are any other stock rotors that would work. I'm thinking that maybe a truck would use something similar. How do you check rotor measurements for stock GM vehicles?
#1 make sure the bolt pattern is the same 5x4.75
#2, measure the distance of the hat to the rotor surface. (need a minimum of 26.8mm)
#3, measure the diameter of the rotor (needs to be 12.8" or greater or 325mm-340mm)
#4, measure thickness of the rotor (minimum of 31 mm to a max of 33mm)
thats pretty much it.. most truck rotors are 6 lug..
OK, just went and measured my Baer Extreme GT+ rotors(that are still awaiting installation). Here are the measurememnts:
1) Bolt pattern is fine 5x4.75
2) See below
3) Diameter is 13 1/8" or 333.375mm
4) Thickness is 1 1/4" or 31.75mm
OK, the backspacing - done it for wheels, never brakes. Not sure if you wanted me to measure from the outside of the hat (where the lug nuts are) or the inside (rests against the hub) and then to the outside face of the rotor or the inside. So, I did it all. Here they are:
From outside of hat to inside of rotor = 61mm
From outside of hat to outside of rotor = 30mm
From inside of hat to inside of rotor = 53mm
From inside of hat to outside of rotor = 22mm
I'm hoping that it's not the 22mm, but I'm suspecting it is. Let me know if these work. I'm seriously considering just buying one from a local GM place and test fitting it - I think they accept returns up to 30 days with receipt.
1) Bolt pattern is fine 5x4.75
2) See below
3) Diameter is 13 1/8" or 333.375mm
4) Thickness is 1 1/4" or 31.75mm
OK, the backspacing - done it for wheels, never brakes. Not sure if you wanted me to measure from the outside of the hat (where the lug nuts are) or the inside (rests against the hub) and then to the outside face of the rotor or the inside. So, I did it all. Here they are:
From outside of hat to inside of rotor = 61mm
From outside of hat to outside of rotor = 30mm
From inside of hat to inside of rotor = 53mm
From inside of hat to outside of rotor = 22mm
I'm hoping that it's not the 22mm, but I'm suspecting it is. Let me know if these work. I'm seriously considering just buying one from a local GM place and test fitting it - I think they accept returns up to 30 days with receipt.
From outside of hat to outside of rotor = 30mm
Wilwood sell this combo, so does Stoptech and Baer.
what did you pay for this hat/rotor combo? is it part of Baer's big brake upgrade kit?
I'm seriously considering just buying one from a local GM place and test fitting it - I think they accept returns up to 30 days with receipt
From: customerservice@gmpartsdirect.com
To: XXXXXXX@aol.com
Sent: Fri, 15 Sep 2006 9:30 AM
Subject: RE: Customer Service Request 1295
Thanks for your inquiry to www.gmpartsdirect.com.
Here are your part numbers you requested.
89047726 passenger front brake caliper, without pads.
89047227 driver front brake caliper, without pads.
You can go to http://www.gmpartsdirect.com on our home page you will have to
enter your part number into the SEARCH space provided on our homepage. You will
then have to add this number to your shopping cart and click check out to see
total charges with shipping and handling delivered to your door.
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local dealer. As a note, special order and electrical parts are non-returnable
so please verify your part numbers are correct.
Email response hours are from 9 to 6 est, Mon to Fri. Orders and emails after 3
pm Friday est. will not be processed until Monday.
Thank you for choosing www.GmPartsDirect.com
-----Original Message-----
From: customerservice@gmpartsdirect.com [mailto:customerservice@gmpartsdirect.com]
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 5:18 PM
To: Customer Service
Subject: Customer Service Request
E-mail: XXXXXXX@aol.com
Date: 09/14/2006 05:17 PM
Make: Cadillac
Year: 2005
Model: CTS-V
Miles:
VIN Number: ?
Contact Information
Name: David
E-mail: XXXXXXX@aol.com
Address: XXXXXXXX
City: XXXXXXXX
State: XX Zip: XXXXX
Message Text: I am looking for Cadillac CTS-V Brembo 4 Piston front calipers. I
need the Front Left and Front Right. Please advise on GM Part #'s for these 2
items.
Thank you
This electronic message transmission contains information from
www.GMPartsDirect.com
may be confidential or privileged. The information is intended solely for the
recipient,
and use by any other party that is not authorized. If you are not the intended
recipient, be
aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this
information is
prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please
notify us
immediately by electronic mail (customerservice@gmpartsdirect.com).
To: XXXXXXX@aol.com
Sent: Fri, 15 Sep 2006 9:30 AM
Subject: RE: Customer Service Request 1295
Thanks for your inquiry to www.gmpartsdirect.com.
Here are your part numbers you requested.
89047726 passenger front brake caliper, without pads.
89047227 driver front brake caliper, without pads.
You can go to http://www.gmpartsdirect.com on our home page you will have to
enter your part number into the SEARCH space provided on our homepage. You will
then have to add this number to your shopping cart and click check out to see
total charges with shipping and handling delivered to your door.
If you have a question regarding this email please include all contents of this
email, including the original email you sent, so we can keep track of the
conversation. Please keep in mind gmpartsdirect.com cannot be held responsible
for incorrect part numbers. Please feel free to validate the accuracy with your
local dealer. As a note, special order and electrical parts are non-returnable
so please verify your part numbers are correct.
Email response hours are from 9 to 6 est, Mon to Fri. Orders and emails after 3
pm Friday est. will not be processed until Monday.
Thank you for choosing www.GmPartsDirect.com
-----Original Message-----
From: customerservice@gmpartsdirect.com [mailto:customerservice@gmpartsdirect.com]
Sent: Thursday, September 14, 2006 5:18 PM
To: Customer Service
Subject: Customer Service Request
E-mail: XXXXXXX@aol.com
Date: 09/14/2006 05:17 PM
Make: Cadillac
Year: 2005
Model: CTS-V
Miles:
VIN Number: ?
Contact Information
Name: David
E-mail: XXXXXXX@aol.com
Address: XXXXXXXX
City: XXXXXXXX
State: XX Zip: XXXXX
Message Text: I am looking for Cadillac CTS-V Brembo 4 Piston front calipers. I
need the Front Left and Front Right. Please advise on GM Part #'s for these 2
items.
Thank you
This electronic message transmission contains information from
www.GMPartsDirect.com
may be confidential or privileged. The information is intended solely for the
recipient,
and use by any other party that is not authorized. If you are not the intended
recipient, be
aware that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of the contents of this
information is
prohibited. If you have received this electronic transmission in error, please
notify us
immediately by electronic mail (customerservice@gmpartsdirect.com).
Last edited by GR33N GoblinM6; Sep 26, 2006 at 10:14 PM.
Yes, the 30mm is from the outside of the hat (the part that the wheel and lugnuts touch) to the outside of the rotor (the side you can see through the wheel).
As for price, I can't help much. I got the whole kit used, for $275-ish. I've called Baer for replacements, and they are roughly the same prices as you quoted for the rotors.
But, this is for the 2-piece rotor and hat assembly. They also sell an Eradispeed rotor that is a single piece. It may have the same dimensions as mine.
I'm going to look into buying a single one for test fit purposes. What kind of bracket did you have to fabricate? How far are the holes apart? Reason I ask is that I'm wondering if I could use the ones that came with the Baer kit. The calipers with the kit are the same dimensions as the Corvette C5 brakes. If the mounting is the same, then I may be able to put this together.
As for price, I can't help much. I got the whole kit used, for $275-ish. I've called Baer for replacements, and they are roughly the same prices as you quoted for the rotors.
But, this is for the 2-piece rotor and hat assembly. They also sell an Eradispeed rotor that is a single piece. It may have the same dimensions as mine.
I'm going to look into buying a single one for test fit purposes. What kind of bracket did you have to fabricate? How far are the holes apart? Reason I ask is that I'm wondering if I could use the ones that came with the Baer kit. The calipers with the kit are the same dimensions as the Corvette C5 brakes. If the mounting is the same, then I may be able to put this together.
Pending Trans Ram's results.. I may be purchasing some new brakes =)
Keep up the good work guys.. if there are any parts to be fabbed, if anyone can get dimensions, I may be able to fab them up in a CAD environment, and have drawings to be sent to a fabricator, or I may be able to fab them.. Dont know what the vendor rules applying to that are.. but yeah.
Keep up the good work guys.. if there are any parts to be fabbed, if anyone can get dimensions, I may be able to fab them up in a CAD environment, and have drawings to be sent to a fabricator, or I may be able to fab them.. Dont know what the vendor rules applying to that are.. but yeah.
brackets will be much different for the brembo's than Baers.. I have do not have drawing or measurements for brackets, because for that I would have had to have the correct rotor, and the Caliper (which I dont have yet, just a template with measurements)
i figured i would start buying the parts when I KNOW they will work..
i figured i would start buying the parts when I KNOW they will work..
Bad news. I went by a Cadillac dealer today to see about getting info on the caliper and rotor. The bad news is that if you get the caliper, without pads, it does not include the pin or retainer clip. You can order the pin, but not the clip.
I've got a printout of the exploded view of the caliper and the part list for it (I can't post it because the file size keeps getting exceeded, and it's losing resolution to where you can't read it anyway). The pin you'd need to order is part number 11. The clip is number 5. On the part list next to the picture, you can see a part number for the pin (last on the list). But, the clip has no part number, and is therefore not orderable. Also not included or orderable are the shims (part number 2). I expect we could work around that, though. So, the conclusion is that you'd have to order the pads with the caliper to get the whole package.
I'm still trying to find info on rotors. I'm wondering if a stock CTS rotor would work. It has to fit under a 16" wheel, so I suspect not. But, I don't know about rotors for the XLR or STS. I'm also trying to find diemensions for 5-lug truck rotors like GMC Envoy and such.
As a last resort, I think that one could get one of those 1" spacers that has studs pressed into it. They sell them at a dirt track shop here locally - and I'm sure online as well. It basically bolts to your hub with the standard lug nuts and then has 5 additional bolts sticking out to bolt the wheel to. This would probably bolt over the rotor, thus giving more room for the caliper. In fact, this could be ultimately cheaper, as you could run the cheap (but good) C5 rotors, and just use the spacer. Here's what I'm talking about (except a spacer, not an adapter as is pictured).
I've got a printout of the exploded view of the caliper and the part list for it (I can't post it because the file size keeps getting exceeded, and it's losing resolution to where you can't read it anyway). The pin you'd need to order is part number 11. The clip is number 5. On the part list next to the picture, you can see a part number for the pin (last on the list). But, the clip has no part number, and is therefore not orderable. Also not included or orderable are the shims (part number 2). I expect we could work around that, though. So, the conclusion is that you'd have to order the pads with the caliper to get the whole package.
I'm still trying to find info on rotors. I'm wondering if a stock CTS rotor would work. It has to fit under a 16" wheel, so I suspect not. But, I don't know about rotors for the XLR or STS. I'm also trying to find diemensions for 5-lug truck rotors like GMC Envoy and such.
As a last resort, I think that one could get one of those 1" spacers that has studs pressed into it. They sell them at a dirt track shop here locally - and I'm sure online as well. It basically bolts to your hub with the standard lug nuts and then has 5 additional bolts sticking out to bolt the wheel to. This would probably bolt over the rotor, thus giving more room for the caliper. In fact, this could be ultimately cheaper, as you could run the cheap (but good) C5 rotors, and just use the spacer. Here's what I'm talking about (except a spacer, not an adapter as is pictured).
mm.. no on the spacers... it pushes the wheels too far outward and will rub on the fenders and would look retarded.. thought about those already.. plus Skulte makes some in 3/4"
but I have your solution to the brakes... I have part #'s that include the pads and hardware.. price is $166 each (plus their 20%)
good work on the findings
but I have your solution to the brakes... I have part #'s that include the pads and hardware.. price is $166 each (plus their 20%)
good work on the findings